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Comment by criddell | Hacker News Reader

I'd like that too. My current device is a Thinkpad Yoga that I love, but I've lost a lot of trust in Lenovo and don't think I would buy from them again. There really isn't anything out there other than a Macbook (running Windows in a VM or reformatted) that I can see myself getting.

I also wish they would release a smaller version of Windows for business use. I want my operating system to simply support the software I run. Cortana, live tiles, and most personalization functions decrease the value of Windows 10 for me. I'd get rid of all the Bing apps (Weather, Finance, Sports, News, Music, etc...) too. If you don't use them, it's just bloatware and I don't understand why they make it difficult to uninstall those applications.

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Try checking how much space the Bing apps take up, preferably before you've used any of them....

Windows 10 is actually quite economical in the space it uses. Remember, the full OS runs on 32-bit tablets with only 1GB of RAM and 32GB of storage.

The MacBook means giving up the touch-screen, tablet and high-end pen functionality that you would get with a Surface Pro.

Also, it seems a little inconsistent to worry about the space taken up by Bing apps while contemplating a solution that requires two whole operating systems and a VM ;-)

> Try checking how much space the Bing apps take up

Space is one concern. The other is that these things tend to be taking up cycles in the background. So there is some power consumption and bandwidth use. Plus, none of them are bug-free and so there are security concerns as well (not to mention the privacy issues).

> giving up the touch-screen, tablet and high-end pen functionality that you would get with a Surface Pro

If those functions were useful to me, I would be happy with a Surface Pro or Book. I have a Thinkpad Yoga that can do all that stuff and I've never actually used any of it other than to try it.

> it seems a little inconsistent to worry about the space taken up by Bing apps while contemplating a solution that requires two whole operating systems

The difference is that I have no interest in running any of those applications whereas if I had Mac OS available, there are Mac applications I would run (I'm a big fan of the Omni Group's software). No matter what machine I have, I'll be running Linux in a VM anyway, so that VM overhead is acceptable.

> I have a Thinkpad Yoga that can do all that stuff and > I've never actually used any of it other than to try it.

That surprises me, since I've just had to admit to myself that the ability to manipulate the screen directly is extremely useful.

Thinking like you, I recently bought a new laptop without a touch screen (it was cheaper). A couple of weeks later, I returned it and paid the extra for one with a touch screen.

Re Bing apps, they take up almost no space, use almost no resources, and are completely sandboxed. You might want to look into Windows Runtime, including https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/apps/hh4649...

I work mostly with text so the most important thing to me is having a good keyboard. I don't like touchscreen laptops because I don't like fingerprints on the screen.

> I recently bought a new laptop

What laptop do you use and how do you like it?

As for the Bing apps, I get it that for what they do, they are efficient. But for me they provide no value and so the fact that they use some space, CPU, bandwidth, have bugs, and have privacy issues means that I would like to be able to uninstall them and not think about them. I don't understand why they aren't at least easily uninstalled. It makes me wonder if the data they send back to Microsoft is valuable even when they aren't actively used.

It looks to me like all you have to do to uninstall them is go to System -> Apps and Features, select the app, and click uninstall.

Am I missing something? I tried it on a few and it seems to work fine.

When I tried to do that, a bunch of them had no uninstall option and I had to do a PowerShell command to get rid of them.

I followed the instructions on this page: http://www.howtogeek.com/224798/how-to-uninstall-windows-10s...

Uninstalling Cortana is even trickier so I haven't done anything with it yet, but it's probably the feature I would most like to get rid of.

Microsoft said: "You can turn off Input Personalization at any time. This will stop the data collection for this feature and will delete associated data stored on your device, such as your local user dictionary and your input history. As Cortana uses this data to help understand your input, turning off Input Personalization will also disable Cortana on your device. At https://www.bing.com/account/personalization, you can also clear data sent to Microsoft, such as your contacts and calendar data, user dictionary, as well as search and browsing history if your device also had Cortana enabled."

Cortana is just a cute name for part of the indexed search feature, which is controlled by Group Policies:

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/mt577208%28v=vs....

Cortana is not turned on by default, and if she's not been turned on, there is no real benefit to removing "her".

However, for the record, I think Cortana is great....

Since Windows 10 is "Windows as a service", patched and maintained remotely, I'd expect random screwing around to be repaired remotely. However, it would be interesting to know if this will affect Windows' stability or performance. However, in general, it's probably a bad idea to mess around with the workings of things you don't understand.

This is one of the reasons I don't mess around with Android, or try to remove all the Google apps I don't want, or remove Google Now ;-)

Thank you for all the information.

I don't have a Microsoft account, so the account personalization link doesn't work. Unfortunately, my machine is still constantly contacting Microsoft. It's a problem because I'm often tethering my computer to my phone and I have pretty limited bandwidth caps.

Ah. Have you set Windows 10 to not download from a metered account?

The main point of Windows 10 is that it's a mobile operating system with cloud integration. (Remember, the same OS runs on smartphones. Cortana, apps, and Live Tiles came from Windows Phone.)

The Microsoft account gives you access to 15GB of free space on OneDrive, and the online Office apps (including OneNote and some new ones). The idea is to use the same apps on iOS and Android smartphones and tablets so you get the benefits of a cross-platform ecosystem.

It's also maintained and updated on a continuous basis -- remember it's "Windows as a Service". If you read all of this page (1), it will give you a good idea of the telemetry involved.

If you had Windows 10 Pro laptop joined to a company domain you would get a lot of control, but if you're operating as a consumer/amateur then you're fighting the whole design of the system, and that's probably a losing battle. It's like a vegan complaining about a steak-house menu.

Try running ShutUp10 from http://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10

Have you thought of switching to Linux Mint? ;-)

(1) https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/mt577208%28v=vs....

That will work if you're tethering via WiFi, but Windows won't let you set an "Ethernet" (RNDIS) connection as metered, presumably because no Microsoft engineer has encountered such thing as a bandwidth cap.

Ah, many thanks for the info!

Currently on a Lenovo Yoga, being the cheapest range with a decent keyboard. However, it's a holdover machine. The longer term plan is to buy something designed for Windows 10, probably next year. (Windows 10 isn't finished and the hardware isn't here yet.) So, at this stage, I don't know.

Re Bing apps, they were created to get some stylish-looking apps into the Windows Store, to get Windows 8 users used to apps, and to provide examples to third-party developers. I expect them to be installed on demand, and a couple of them are already scheduled to be discontinued. They're really not worth obsessing over.

In PowerShell, you can run

  Get-AppxPackage *bing* | Remove-AppxPackage

to get rid of those Bing apps.

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