Comment by mcherm | Hacker News Reader

Comment by mcherm | Hacker News Reader

Hi! I'm a developer for ING Direct, and I'm pleased that you speak so highly of your experience here. I wonder if I can help out some with the concerns you still have. You mention not having branches -- which is true, but we DO run the occasional internet cafe complete with trained ING barista/bankers (no... I'm really serious!). You say you live in Hawaii, so consider stopping by 1958 Kalakaua Ave, Honolulu HI and saying "Hi".

You also talk about the trouble of mailing a check 5000 miles (it's closer to 4000, but who's counting?). I'm sympathetic: what kind of system would you prefer? For instance, do you think you should be able to scan the check at your PC and enter it that way? Would you rather have a payments system so that you don't need to use checks at all? Nothing will happen magically tomorrow, but I'd be very interested to hear what HN readers think, and I'd keep it in mind as we work to improve our systems!

Starting a bank is HARD... I wish you luck in your endeavor, but it MAY be easier to find a "good" bank (different people may have different ideas about what that means) and support them. You are certainly welcome to pass on your good ideas to someone like me.

As a happy ING Direct customer, here are my comments:

- I'm extremely jealous of USAA's Deposit@Home feature. Depositing a check just by snapping a photo in an iPhone app? Yes, please.

- I've received an answer about the required linked account before, but I still don't like it. ING really can do everything I need from a bank - dealing with another one is just annoying.

- It sounds like you two are talking about depositing checks into an ING account by mail? I didn't even know that was possible. The only thing I use my linked checking account for is making deposits and then transferring them to ING. Why isn't this option mentioned in any help topics regarding deposits?

Hey eggsagain,

I use USAA and it is awesome. I have never used deposit@home because I generally go for direct deposit, but maybe I'll try it. They give you pre-paid stamped envelopes for depositing checks. That is what I use for the rare times I have to cash a random check. Now that I live in NYC with copious blue boxes, it is even easier.

To join USAA you have to be a veteran or a relative of a veteran. I'm lucky that both of my parents were in the Navy. I've tried other banks and always felt I was getting shafted in some way. USAA, on the other hand consistently makes you feel like you are getting a good deal.

Actually, you don't have to be related to the armed forces in any way to join USAA bank. I am not even a US citizen, and I was able to sign-up without trouble. All you have to do is answer no to all the questions about the armed forces, and it will still allow you to open an account.

Depositing checks IS supported, at least for customers who have a "Electric Orange" checking account with ING Direct. We don't go out of our way to encourage people to do it because processing checks is expensive for the bank. But you can find instructions on our FAQ page: http://home.ingdirect.com/faqs/faqs.asp?s=Deposits

Depositing a check by snapping a photo with a phone? That's pretty fancy! But perhaps it's something we should take a look at.

I have USAA and use the Deposit@Home feature regularly. it is amazing and simple. I have deposited by scanner and by phone and have yet to have a check that didn't go through successfully and I've done it at least a hundred times. I don't use my USAA account for anything but that reason. Also, because of this feature I no longer use brick and mortar banks either.

The only checks I've had that don't go through are when the signature goes through the Account/Routing/Check number space. I'm guessing the errant pen stroke messes with the OCR they use.

The giant hole in usefulness of banks that I see is that doing bank to bank transfers of money aren't easy on a customer. For example, I have my checking account at one bank, and my car loan at another. In order to pay my car loan, I drive to bank #1, withdraw cash, drive to bank #2, and deposit.

EFT is mostly inaccessible to customers. Checks work, and would avoid the bank #1 in my process, but take extra time to clear. Wire transfers work, but would charge me a decent sized fee every time.

Basically, it shouldn't be so difficult to transfer money between banks at the customer's level. But I also understand that interbank coordination is done at a higher level than any one bank. So ING for example can't just say "here's a new interface" and let people go for it.

I suppose my question is: how do we advance the banking system in areas that require system-wide simultaneous upgrades?

Actually, there is a system in place for any bank to transfer money to another account at another bank. Its called ACH (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_Clearing_House), and thats how direct debit and most other interbank transfers in the US work. Internationally there is SWIFT and wire transfers, but within the US all that you really need is a name, account number, and bank routing number. All of this information is printed on a personalized check from any bank; thats why some people ask for a void check to setup auto-pay.

That said banks in the US have been very very slow to make this technology easy for customer's to use, partially because they just suck at user friendly technology, and partly because they don't want to make it too easy for people to move their money to an account at another bank.

Well, ING Direct tries to make it reasonably easy for our customers to make these sorts of transfers. For instance, once you set up a "linked" account (ie, prove to us that you own an account at another institution) you can transfer money between them at any time with a click on our website. If you have "Electric Orange" (our checking account), then you can also do things like sending a payment electronically (pick it up by email) or having us mail a check.

In a way, I think we HAVE said "here's a new interface" and let people "go for it".

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