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Comment by FussyZeus | Hacker News Reader

I really don't want to sound elitist, but my choice to go full Macbook and keep my custom built PC at home has never looked better. How long until we hear about other manufacturers also doing this?

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If I were looking at a Windows system I would now only consider buying those branded with Microsoft Signature.

Except then you have the privacy concerns with Windows 10.

That's why I'm still running 7.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/2952664

This KB sneaks in diagtrack.dll to windows 7, aka telemetry.

Which you can decline to install, on Windows 7.

Do you always get prompted or does it install automatically in certain circumstances?

I have diagtrack on my work win8.1 without being prompted. I'll have to check win7 on monday. This is the first non win10 kb I've seen it mentioned in.

I have no clue how it got onto my win8.1 box.

If you go into Control Panel, Programs and Features, you can retroactively uninstall updates. It's in the other section of that application.

At least for 7, I never used 8 enough to give you useful info there.

Although you are trying to be helpful, you did not answer the question that I asked. Retroactively uninstall is not my definition of decline to install.

Also, it's not clear which KB snuck it onto my Win8.1.

It turns out that KB2952664 is pretty hard to uninstall. I tried several times to uninstall it from the control panel on Windows 7, and each time it was still present afterwards. It turns out this update has many versions, each of which need to be uninstalled separately:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/unable...

My machine had 27 different packages/versions for this update!

Good grief, I have 23 versions installed on my system. None of which show up in 'installed updates' in Windows Update. And when I try to remove them with dism I get an access denied error.

A cynical person would think MS is deviously trying to hide them and prevent an end user from opting out from their data collection scheme.

Oh sorry, I misread that. You can decline any updates, personally I have mine set to Download automatically but let me choose to install. Then you just untick it. Of course it's a Microsoft Recommended update so it will come checked, but the actual install is still up to you.

I believe it will remember this preference for future installs, as in won't keep checking it each time but I've honestly never looked into it so I can't say for certain.

Not so sure that the KB text description in control panel will give enough info.

It's only after months of reading about it do I know enough to discern that diagtrack.dll == "telemetry".

The statement 'Which you can decline to install' makes it seem as if this is specifically flagged and you have the option of not installing it.

In reality you are describing the standard options: Automatically Update/Let Me Choose Which Updates/No Updates at all.

When users are advised to install this stuff for their own good for security purposes(Microsoft Recommended), and yet this is basically malware/a keylogger - it's pretty bad in my opinion.

@tux3 can and did.

I said if. I'm stilling running 7 with Debian in a VM. Looking to invert this if possible in my next system--with Windows in the VM with an AMD graphics card passed through so I can still play games.

Dell fans said something very similar just two weeks ago. Apple has root certificate authority on its own. Here is a list of their certificates :-)

https://www.apple.com/certificateauthority/

There's very little to be smug about:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spotlight_(software)#Privacy_c...

I've had a macbook for 2 years and I've never used spotlight beyond the initial "what does this do?" moment. Besides, you can't really do search without knowing what is searched for and from where it is being searched.

The few things that I use spotlight for kind of necessitate location data anyways, I keep it on Cmd + Shift + Space and use Alfred on Cmd + Space. I find it does really well when you're looking for restaurants in your area and things like that.

Once you get used to cmd+space. It's so much easier to hit the key combo, type the first letters of the program you want and hit enter than clicking through a bunch of folders and scrolling around.. but after reading this wikipedia article, I think I may have to find an alternative.

Check out Alfred. I use the free version myself, you can un-assign command space from Spotlight in OS X first, then assign Command Space to that. It does basically the same thing minus the Internet connected stuff like location searching and whatnot.

Alfred can be setup to index folders, contents of text files, pictures, etc. and harder things like System Prefs screens too.

I myself keep Spotlight on Command Shift Space for the rare occasions when I want to take advantage of the Internet connected stuff, but keep using Alfred for everything else (less to do with privacy, more because Alfred is just quicker.)

The twelve programs I use most frequently are all on my dock, or accessible from the command line, which I can access by pressing opt+space. Everything else I just use the app menu for.

Or just turn off the web features. It's quite trivial to do so. http://www.howtogeek.com/224344/how-to-disable-spotlights-we...

Don't use Spotlight, I prefer Alfred.

I can't stop laughing, what in the world in this comment necessitated bad karma?

You spoke poorly of an Apple product which means you criticised the official church and its messiah.

I guess I didn't picture the HN community as avid apple fans.

Thank you for posting this. I had no idea.

And as a heavy spotlight user, it's infuriating to know apple is stealing my local computer searches and my location and then selling it to Microsoft.

It makes you wonder what else they are doing if they can be so blatant about it.

you just sound foolish tbh.

http://www.extremetech.com/mobile/197005-new-apple-malware-i...

I don't count physical access required attacks as something I need to worry about. Besides the fact that I only own and use a very small number of thunderbolt devices, my machine is always in my possession.

I didn't say a Mac was bulletproof, but the fact that Apple controls the hardware and software makes it better than the OEM's who make PCs, IMHO. No software or hardware protection will ever do better than a vigilant user, and I know that.

> you just sound foolish

Please don't call names in HN comments.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Blatant ad hominem attacks are not worthy of detachment? Not to mention linking to the same blog post in 2 separate comments w/in a minute? I must say that I am bewildered...

This isn't the place for this. You're welcome to email us at hn@ycombinator.com if you have questions about moderation.

I was looking for clarity in a transparent process so that others could benefit. I'll just assume there are rules not meant for public consumption and shutup.

a response to this

> I really don't want to sound elitist, but my choice to go full Macbook and keep my custom built PC at home has never looked better.

not really name calling imho but ok, I know. It is not my normal behaviour.

Never leave the original os on a laptop. That has been the golden rule of wintel laptops. Install clean windows and nuke the factory recovery partition.

Except that has already been worked around in Lenovo's case by using the BIOS to install crapware/malware on a clean install.

http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=29497693&sid=dd...

Ars's news article: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/08/lenovo...

Not superfish.

It could install superfish or anything it wants but you are correct, I've updated it to say crapware instead.

Apple products have a similar flaw

http://www.extremetech.com/mobile/197005-new-apple-malware-i...

Once you have physical access to the machine, the war is over.

this is like the Lenovo driver issue. Your peripherals install software without your explicit consent

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