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Comment by sailormoon | Hacker News Reader

I agree. I also disliked this:

One friend said she's dreading her boyfriend's upcoming birthday because he views it as his "anything he wants" night. While she doesn't mind dressing up, she's dreading the "porn requests" (she didn't specify what those are, so we can only imagine).

That's not porn that is the problem. What is stopping this lady from simply telling her boyfriend what she does and does not like? And what kind of dysfunctional relationship is this if the boyfriend doesn't get to do "anything he wants" as a matter of course? Why is it a special birthday present for him to receive the satisfaction he obviously needs? Sounds like they're not really such a great match after all and porn is just a scapegoat.

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Do you seriously think that in a functional relationship (as opposed to a dysfunctional one) a boyfriend get to do 'anything he wants'? Or a girlfriend, for that matter?

It's perfectly legitimate (not to mention a fact in 99.99% of relationships by my estimate) for partners to have different needs and wants. And limits. Yes.

Compromises are a way of life for a good couple. Having 'special occasions' is not a bad way to go about these compromises, doing something for your partner you wouldn't want to do on a regular basis, with a nice socially acceptable rhythm to it.

To pick an example at random, I wouldn't buy my jewelry every day (or week, or month), but a couple of times a year for special occasions (birthday, anniversary) are cool.

Wrapping up, if there was an increasing cultural effect making my wife expect (and hint at) increasingly weird and tasteless things that she'd like for her birthday (I'd getting shivers just imagining examples), believe you me I wouldn't be happy about it, and saying no would still not be easy.

BTW: if you comment above was sarcastic and I missed it, consider this comment moot.

I was not sarcastic. Far from it.

I think there's a big difference between buying people whatever they want, whenever they want it, and sexual satisfaction. Of course you do not buy your partner jewellery every day or week. Good jewellery is expensive. And you can only wear so much.

But sexual satisfaction is different. Sex is free. And if the guy is not satisfied in their normal sexual behaviour, and has to wait until his birthday when he can really do all those things he wanted to do the rest of the year - well, I think that is weird and kind of pathological.

So yes in summary, in bed, of course each person in a couple should be able to "do whatever they want". Why wouldn't they? Just like they should be able to talk about whatever they want and watch whatever they want. If they can't do these basic things then .. what's the point of even being a couple?

This sounds good, but it's not true in reality. Couples rarely see eye to eye on 100% of topics, so in a stable relationship, many things become a compromise of sorts.

Everyone should feel fulfilled by sex, but that doesn't mean that the woman should be expected to do depraved sex acts that she's uncomfortable with, just like the man shouldn't be expected to spread rose petals on the bed and sing sonnets each time.

If a couple isn't in the same ballpark on sex, they should probably not be a couple.

If a woman really wants rose petals/sonnets, she shouldn't have to wait for her birthday to get it. It's hardly an unreasonable request every 1-2 weeks. And if her partner can't give it to her, she should move on.

It doesn't need to be such a point of contention and resentment, though -- the author of the article writes as if sex is a begrudging gift, and that the way she happens to view sex is the way we men need to learn to see it. In short: emotionally she's about 11 years old.

Agreed, the author isn't sexually mature. I think I was more sexually mature when I was 13 than the author appears to be.

Sex is a partnership. It's (generally) two people and (generally) one bed. If your sex life isn't to people participating, it isn't sex. The author sounds like she's a 'lays down and take it' kind of 'lover', which gives me the shudders.

Sex is a lot of things, but non-participating in it is IMHO akin to trying to be raped. It's nonsensical, and it IMHO sounds like non-consensual sex. I clearly don't comprehend it, but perhaps that's because when I wasn't even sexually developed I was aware of what sex was supposed to be.

What if I like two chicks at the same time for my birthday? I think my girl-friend would find it very easy to say no to that.

I think the perspective of younger women is that they have to acquiesce or else they will not have a boyfriend. That is, if it is fairly universal that younger men demand such things from their girlfriends then women must decide to acquiesce or be celibate. I'm not saying this is the case but it is the author's point. Well, I believe it is her point.

They are saying that too many younger males have had their perspectives skewed by pornography and that something needs to be done about this. Maybe what the boyfriend really wants is something similar to '2 girls 1 cup' and that this want is the result of porn?

Perspectives skewed? Isn't that another way of saying expectations raised? You could just as well complain about people not being happy with a normal job because their perspectives have been "skewed" by reading PG's essays. Maybe the porn just opened their eyes to what was possible.

I don't know, it just seems the whole thrust of the article is "sex is bad enough, but hardcore sex is even worse, and it's all porn's fault!".

And for what it's worth, myself and pretty much everyone I know have seen our share of pr0n, and I cannot imagine any of us thinking that 2girls1cup-style behaviour is desirable. I mean geeze, talk about the absolute worst example imaginable. Well, except SWAP.avi.

And yeah I'm aware I'm not arguing with you except as a proxy for the site .. ;)

> Maybe the porn just opened their eyes to what was possible.

I think the point is less about the mechanics of sexual contact (which is what your more talking about I think) as the interaction and emotional experience.

I watch a lot of pornography in my job; not in a sexual context but in a more abstract have to see the content way. It's quite an eye opener to see so much in an objective way.

In most porn the woman is highly submissive and either pleading for more pleasure or eager to provide sexual favours to the men. I find it hard to disagree with people that say pornography shows people (mostly, but not exclusively, the women) as objects - I do disagree with the conclusions they ultimately draw from that; but if people are emulating what they see as pornography in real life it's not the basis for a healthy relationship.

Well, that's a whole different rabbit-hole you're jumping down there. My comments here have been seen as anti-female in the past so I'll refrain from airing my views on the matter but suffice to say I think sexual behaviour in general and pornography in particular reflects a very long-standing social dynamic.

I have never known a man who was selected against because he was dominant.

> I have never known a man who was selected against because he was dominant.

Harem attendants where eunuchs for reason. :P

> In most porn the woman is highly submissive and either pleading for more pleasure or eager to provide sexual favours to the men.

So, where do you find this... not most porn?

Lesbian porn. Female Dom. female targetted porn. And all sorts of other genres. :-)

There is also a small genre of pornography which shows realistic sex.

Are you forgetting homemade porn? That seems like a much larger segment than those others, but is realistic by definition.

Should we automatically assume that when couples perform in homemade porn they're doing exactly what they would do off camera?

> Maybe the porn just opened their eyes to what was possible.

I do not agree with you, but that is a very interesting point of view. Never thought it like that. :)

What is it that you don't agree with? Are you saying that everyone that watches porn immediately likes everything they see and adopts it as a defacto standard in the bedroom? If so, why are there not more people complaining about their lover/sex-buddy wanting 2girl1cup-style sex?

Is it not more reasonable that people watch porn and then adopt the things that they see which appeal to them? If so, then this whole argument is about whether or not people should be allowed exposure to new ideas which they might agree with and adopt into their view of the world (and/or expectations of it).

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