Hacker News Reader

Comment by Apocryphon | Hacker News Reader

Looking at that list, I'll have to ask again: why isn't Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill on it? I haven't been there myself, but it confirms my suspicions that while that place might be a tech hotbed, it's more of the research park bigcorp and research institution type, than of the startup variety. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's just interesting because on HN we usually associate "tech" as the former and not the latter. So other places like RTP or DFW might get overlooked.

View on HN

I'm not sure I would be comfortable in a state where the government favors passing laws that _prevent_ anti-discrimination laws from being passed. I don't know how that area leans towards this issue and so I'm not saying that area is to blame, but I find it hard to want to go where the state actively tries to allow discrimination. Granted this only happened recently, but my opinion of NC before was that it didn't have a sterling reputation in welcoming non-White, non-Christian Americans.

And you may point to CA's Prop 8 passing as a counter-point, but I think one of the reasons for it passing was some voters assuming it wouldn't pass, and also the confusion of whether or not you're suppose to vote for/against if you're for/against same-sex marriage. Regardless, at least the State of CA fought against it and refused to enforce it.

Please stop this recreational outrage. For something that is as fresh as a tomato(not even a month old), you are inserting a topic (perceived anti-lgbtq law) that has little to with the macro trends of the past decade. This constant overreach poisons the discussion.

"constant overreach"? Are you addressing the comment or just getting angry over a perceived slight? They literally said "Granted this only happened recently" but you're lecturing them about how recently this has happened? It's not controversial to say that people not from North Carolina have an opinion of it being place with a history of racism (really, you could say that about just about anywhere).

This is exactly the overreach I am talking about, inserting social issues into subjects that are not about them or have at the best mild correlation.

Social issues are a symptom of the lack of acceptance of different ideas, which along with access to capital, people with the right education and abilities, along with a core of existing software companies that can calve off people with money and trained developers are some of the main reasons why certain places do succeed as startup incubators. That law was more than some mere pesky "social issue", it is about fundamental human rights.

>...lack of acceptance of different ideas, which along with access to capital, people with the right education and abilities

Are you suggesting that the Bay area's success rests on the back of unimpeachable diversity? The demographics of Bay Area founders skews young, rich, pale and male. Women and non-whites tend not to have limited access to VC, as countless blog posts & news articles will attest. Heck, even white males from the 'wrong' schools struggle.

So you can strike out diversity as the engine driving the Bay Area, and likely not holding back NC.

LOL, sorry my post was so long that you can't even read it in its entirety. I literally addressed what you said in my post; that law is but the most recent example of a history of suppression of minorities.

"Macro trends", you mean like the Voter ID laws? The continued traditions of Jim Crow Laws such as keeping blacks from being in the jury of black criminals?

But hey, answering why someone wouldn't consider N.C. as a place to live by completely dismissing their opinions is definitely not poisoning the discussion right? And definitely not a social issue at all.

Upvoted you, but RTP is like Austin, TX. Bright blue on a red background. Most people from SFC would feel perfectly at home, except for the jarring experience of buying a nice house with land and less than a 30 minute commute for under $300K.

I think it's unfair a bit to single out NC specifically on HB2-like, voter ID, et al laws when it's a part of a broader national political initiative to push model legislation by one party (skirting the subject, look at the similarity in laws passed in states with conservative legislatures and executives, like how NC finds itself currently).

And Prop 8 is not an invalid counterpoint. CA has a similar dynamic (progressive urban areas with conservative rural areas: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9d/US_House...) to what has led to the current situation in NC.

Regardless, HB2 is an embarrassing disgrace that NC has to deal with.

That was my main issue with the article. It conflates "tech sector" with "startup ecosystem". Seattle would not be landing so many engineering outposts if it were really flagging.

That's 100% the title's fault. The content of the story is about startup ecosystems.

Seattle is not lagging. It's hotter than ever.

Well, one thing is that RTP and DFW tend not to have the laws that places like California does, regarding employee protection against non-competes. Meaning that people are generally not empowered to create their own startups, which is a key component of Silicon Valley's success. Another is the lack of money, and a third, especially true now, is the fact that bills like NC's HB2 can actually be passed in those states.

Non-competes suck. You have a few options when leaving a company:

  * Get the blessing of the old employer to work at the new company.

  * Work around the restrictions (geographic area, industry, list of companies, ...)

  * Fight it.

  * Ignore it, ensure the new company will too, and hope for the best.

Anecdotally, I've heard of companies sending out cease and desist letters. The letters were ignored by the new employer/employee and it went no further.

Compare that to this: http://www.cnet.com/news/calif-supreme-court-finds-noncompet...

Thing is, with the exception of Los Angeles, all those other cities in the top 10 also suffer under the chilling effects on labor mobility that RTP and DFW do.

I grew up nearby, and virtually all of my friends from high school are attending universities in the Triangle.

After looking at the criteria used to compile the list, I can say that RTP still fails to compete in multiple categories. There is still little funding available in the area for people looking to spin up a "tech" startup, especially for series A and later. The region hasn't had many exits recently (at least, that I can recall), hurting the area in the "performance" category. Additionally, this means there aren't many "startup veterans" around to mentor younger business, dinging the RTP in the "startup experience" category.

There is certainly a growing entrepreneurship scene in the area. There are plenty of healthy, bootstrapped SMBs in the area applying tech to novel problems. But these aren't the types of businesses that come up on Hacker News regularly.

Bronto, iContact, Reverbnation, Ansible, Pendo... there are startups (3 of those have already had good exits).

Keep in mind it's a strong life & ag science play. At least 3 strong feeder schools. SAS and Red Hat anchoring tech employment, among others.

It's a fine area for tech startups. Funding isn't a problem, Boston is a short flight away.

Went thru an accelerator there. Great area, awesome people, and punching up a bit on what they've accomplished startup-wise. But there is damn near zero funding there, particularly for anything in consumer/media.

>why isn't Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill on it?

No one wants to live there. It's not in the same league as NYC, LA, Boston, Seattle etc.

This is incorrect, a lot of people want to live there. There are many ways of calculating population growth, but Forbes says that the triangle is the 4th fastest growing metro area in the country:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erincarlyle/2015/01/27/americas-...

Having lived in NYC and Seattle, I recently visited Durham and it was pretty rad. Great local breweries and local coffee, fun independent music scene, great barbecue. It certainly isn't midtown Manhattan levels of urban, but I could totally see it being a fun place to live.

It always sounded more like vying for the same league as Portland and Austin, actually.

Pittsburg

The place way out on the BART?

Carrboro: mini-Portland Chapel Hill: mini-Berkeley Durham: mini-Oakland Raleigh: mini-Atlanta

This is a pretty good comparison, imho (lived in Cary since 2003, first for an RTP-based company, then one based on San Jose, and relocating this year to CA). I'm trading my beautiful suburban 4300sqft home on a nice lot in a neighborhood with 2mi of private greenways and very little traffic that I only paid $499k for ... for a 1700sqft ranch built in 1950 costing $1.4m and loads of traffic everywhere you look. The upside is the new job and the tech community, but I'm not 100% convinced I'm trading up re: quality of [family] life.

What city is Cary comparable to?

My 2 cents is I ruled out moving there because there is no easy access to ocean. Boston won over SF because 1 hour drive gets me to warm water.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com