HN: The distress of a young padawan. (rant)

I've never once checked someone's credentials to assess their credibility. I assess credibility by whether the person in question writes/speaks correctly, clearly and creatively.

I know nothing of Jon Skeet's credentials, but he still commands respect because his answers on SO are almost always correct, clear and creative. He doesn't answer when he doesn't have anything to say, and when he does answer, he not only answers the question but answers the questions that his answer will raise. Who he is doesn't matter. What he does matters.

I don't imagine I'm atypical in judging the credibility of developers. If this is how we judge the credibility of others, why do you expect your credibility would be judged differently? How do you start building your online credibility? Start having something creative to say and saying it correctly and clearly. For me at least, that's all there is to it.

Welcome to the club.

In my opinion, anybody who's trying to become better at what they do probably start out feeling this way. I know I did, and I still do sometimes.

Your level of skill and the fact that you're working hard at becoming better at this is what will earn you respect among people. Nobody worthwhile will dismiss you because you're just starting out. Nobody was born knowing this stuff, they all worked hard to it.

I can certainly relate to not being content with your current position. Knowing fully that you don't have to exert a lot of effort to become good. Its not enough, you want to become great. Uncontrolled, this can become destructive behavior though, so watch out.

Personally, I think you're on the right path. Just remember to stop and smell the roses every once in a while.

"I feel like if my IQ was in the genius instead of just very bright range or if I graduated from MIT instead of a Tech school, I could someday..."

Stop that. Right now. Many of the great people you look up to aren't smarter than you, many of them didn't go to the right college. They just worked hard, and worked smart, for long enough. What you're doing here is identifying an external excuse to psychologically allow yourself to fail. I apologise if this seems harsh, but it's true.

It also comes across as really, really whiny.

The only option you've got is just to get on with it. Stop worrying about being a master, or being great - just concentrate on being better than you were yesterday. The rest will sort itself out.

I just want to say you're right. For some reason the up arrow is gone and I can't upvote you. But you're right.

If I am reasonably bright, I am capable of learning if I work hard. I don't have an excuse to fail. Period. There are reasons promising people fail -- they realize, perhaps, that they aren't going after what they really want, or a serious external crisis occurs, or they feel entitled because everyone used to tell them they're smart -- but as long as I am aware of, there are no excuses for falling into those traps.

move around. If your current place does not have people who are significantly better than you are, get another job elsewhere. Repeat until you are surrounded by people who are better than you are.

Develop humility. (False humility is almost always good enough.) remember, If you have not gotten into a place full of people better than you, then you have failed the previous goal. In the technical side of things, almost always it is best to error on the side of humility. (the opposite is true on the business side of things.)

talking about your accomplishments is okay, but it's usually good to acknowledge that you are just learning, or otherwise downplay it.

Ask what you can do to help try to be useful. There are many good people who actively look for mentors. The hard part is finding them.

If you do find someone good willing to help you out, take advantage of it. When I was a little younger than you, I got to work with Paul Vixie. My great regret is that I did not take advantage of the situation as much as I could have; he was willing to mentor me a lot more than I took advantage of. there is a place for doing it all yourself (and certainly, that is the only way to go if you can't find good mentors.) but if you find good people willing to help you, let them help you.

And lastly, choose a mentor who really is better than you. Getting mentored by a mediocre has, eh, mediocre value.

"Can any of you remember what this feels like, as a young developer with no credibility? Have you ever been there? Can you just empathise?"

I still feel like this often after 17 years of professional programming. Don't worry about it.

"How do you guys find MENTORS and ROLE MODELS?"

The internet allows you to learn from the best. Peter Norvig, Paul Graham , john Carmack, Linus Torvalds( my role models in programming , you may choose others) all have code and prose online. Dive in.

Yes. (puts on coach uniform)

I started with nothing -- no degree, no money, no job, no home. Nothing.

Here's what you do: forget the role models and mentors. By the time you find them life will have passed you by. Or you'll get one and he/she will turn out to be a dud. Instead learn to read boring books. Not only read them, but learn to read them and get something out of them.

Then go on a reading spree.

Pick a topic that seems hard to you. I think my first one was Object-Oriented Programming. Something that "real" professionals would know.

Get 6-10 books on that topic. Make it a point to finish them all within 4 months.

Do this a few times. Whatever you do, pick what you think you need to move up. Don't stick with a narrow area. One of my excursions was negotiating. One was marketing. I spent a summer learning C++. I just finished up a sprint with functional programming. I tried to concentrate on the things in which I was weak, assuming my strengths would take care of themselves.

Do this, and I guarantee you that within a couple of years, you'll be moving out/up/on.

But it's hard work. And (smart) hard work, padawan, is what separates the real achievers from the stuck-in-the-same-job complainers. Now let's get out there and kick some ass!

(takes coach uniform off)

Here's a starting point:

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1711/what-is-the-single-m...

Code Complete rocks. It's easily in the top 20 books for any developer. Maybe top 5

Having said that, remember the idea is to stick with a theme, so if you choose good coding, do "Clean Code" by Uncle Bob a few other books along the same lines.

Do you have a top 20 list you could share?

Offtopic, but you know I never really thought Code Complete was that inspirational. But that's probably because i read it after having worked for a few years in the industry and seeing my fair share of bad code and legacy systems.

Of course it was still a good read, and the topics covered were well researched, but not really a life changer for me. Did anyone else feel the same way? It seems that everywhere I go, people say this is THE book to read.

Thanks for the advice. I'm going to try that. 6-10 books. OK. I can do that in 4 months.

First topic: learning, memory & reading comprehension techniques. Then change habits. I have a couple books already.

I would start attending a user group. Linux, Java, functional programming if you can find one, any group with users that are passionate about technology outside of work. At the very least, you should be able to find like minded people.