Iceland's Pirates head for power on wave of public anger | Hacker News Reader

Iceland's Pirates head for power on wave of public anger

uk.reuters.com

78 pointswslh25 comments

I am involved with the Icelandic Pirate Party. I'm a substitute member of the board of Pirates in Reykjavík and a district representative in a new institution of the party, the Information Board, it's role being the production of information for general consumption. Ask Me Anything.

If you had to explain that your party stands for in a simple comment, what would you say it is?

We just recently had this discussion since we are gearing up for the elections. We agreed that besides the basic principles we hold, these 5 points should be emphasized during the run-up to the election: 1. Our constitution needs an upgrade. 2. More equitable distribution of our common property (thinking mostly that revenue from the fishing industry gets taxed properly). 3. Health care should be free. 4. The public should have a say in the legislation process. 5. Reclaim trust and fight corruption.

How are you related to other countries' Pirate Parties?

Loosely affiliated. We are a member of PPEU but have resigned from PPI.

There's a factual error in the article. Birgitta Jónsdóttir is an influential member and won the primary for the capital region (3 districts ran a collaborative primary). She is not a leader of the movement. We aim for as flat a structure as possible. The grassroots are in theory more powerful than our elected representatives. If we are in the position of leading a coalition for government we will see a true test of that principle.

You mean you (personally) are opposed to Burgitta being PM or has this matter been discussed at the party and there's opposition to her?

No. She is interested in being speaker of the house. We have no leaders.

Very interesting story of alternative politics, I like many of the Pirate party positions, but as wonderful as Iceland may be, it's not exactly the center of political change in the world. Bravo to them, but let's see this same movement on the European continent.

Bravo to them, but let's see this same movement on the European continent.

Please, let's NOT see a wave of populist politics in Europe.

It's too late for that, and the other populist parties are often far more worrying than the Pirates.

Germany already had its Pirate Party story and it was a total disaster. 4 years ago they entered a few local parliaments with over 8% of the votes, but in the end the party destroyed itself from the inside. Turns out that if a bunch of nerds form a political party without establishing a good communication structure the whole party ends up looking like a Usenet flamewar. In the last local election in Berlin the Pirate Party had less votes even than a satirical party and the "Animal Protection Party".

I hope the Icelandic learned something from that and don't make the same mistakes.

I imagine a group of people whose base commonality is "we want other people's stuff for free" will find that they jumped into something of a moral tarpit on many levels.

There is a difference between "wanting other people's stuff for free" and believing that the length of copyright (life of author plus 120 years), the penalties for stealing content (5 years felony conviction plus $250,000 fine for each movie downloaded), and the techniques content owners use to get violators (mass sending of dubious lawsuits based on IP address then immediately offer to settle, similar to extortion) has made people angry at IP laws.

>the penalties for stealing content (5 years felony conviction plus $250,000 fine for each movie downloaded

So where exactly do you face such penalties for downloading content?

It's actually $500k https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_law_of_the_United_St...

And how many people have faced criminal copyright charges for downloading movies in the US? (hint: none)

Uhhhh I forgot to respond to this before now, but hundreds every year? Here is one[0]. Another from the Media Institute shows the number of convictions per year through 2011[1]. I don't even understand your arguments. First you didn't believe the penalties were that harsh, then I showed you, then you didn't think anyone actually went to jail, then I showed you. I guess next you'll say no one has ever been executed by the state for downloading movies, so the laws are fine?

[0] https://torrentfreak.com/87-months-in-prison-for-copyright-i... [1] http://www.mediainstitute.org/IPI/2011/052511.php

I don't think you understand. There's a big difference between civil and criminal copyright infringement and it's not exactly easy to commit criminal copyright infringement.

Downloading movies does not carry any criminal penalties, and the possible civil penalties for downloading are minimal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_Copyright_Law_in_the_...

>https://torrentfreak.com/87-months-in-prison-for-copyright-i...

Are you suggesting that a prison sentence was unreasonable for someone selling stolen software licenses at a massive scale? This isn't some guy downloading the newest episode of "Suits", but a somewhat large commercial operation.

You make a really great point. What frustrates me about politics is the focus on how you present something more so than what you stand for. I agree entirely about the train wreck in Germany. They go hand in hand to some extent but at the end of the day what you stand for is what you believe in and that is what we should be supporting.

Many of the political ideas that are now common currency were born in small, out-of-the-way places. The United States was just a collection of small colonies when they rebelled, but that rebellion coalesced some of the most radical ideas that had been brewing on the Continent into action, ideas that have been adopted in some form in places all over the world.

You can go romping about through history to find other ideas that were first put into practice in places far from the centers of power, ideas considered radical at the time that later were adopted by those who became powerful. I'm not a subscriber to dialectical theory, but there is some truth in saying that new ideas that arise in response to bad circumstances often supplant prevailing wisdom. (Dialectics assumes that's always an improvement in the long run, but the evidence for that assertion is lacking in my opinion.)

Indeed, Iceland had an early democracy [1].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Althing

I'm particularly curious about the Edward Snowden angle to this - if the pirate party were elected and if he was granted asylum in Iceland would he take it, or would he try to stick it out in Russia until things cool down back home?

I don't think Edward Snowden will ever be granted asylum in Iceland.

Granting asylum to Snowden without the US' blessing has massive political consequences. If you look at the close ties Iceland has to the US I think it is obvious that this is not going to happen:

- The US are an important market for Icelandic goods, import sanctions will decimate the economy.

- Iceland and the US have trade agreements, which would most likely be rescinded, resulting in higher prices of goods in Iceland.

- Iceland is a party to extradition treaties.

- There is an US airbase in Iceland (although it is mostly just one hanger used for reconnaissance).

The only chance Snowden has to live in Iceland is if his status is downgraded to some kind of "person non grata" (i.e. he is free but will never be able to enter the US).

Living the Greek reality of being governed by a populist party of clueless people, I hope that the Pirates' rise is not just a show of public anger, but rather a conscious decision.

I like a lot of things about Pirates (especially from northen countries), but I hope they are taking it serious and are already preparing (/have prepared) not just proposals for new things but also about the boring "everyday" things that are needed when running a country.

In a world of rise of extreme right-wings and clueless populists, I hope Icelandic people will question things more for the improvement of the politicians as well. Judge by policies not by ideologies is still not widely applied (at least speaking for my country).

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