Perspective from a woman [1]:
> Men in their 30s are running around like children, sabotaging relationships and their lives without obligation or thought of consequence. Why?
[1] https://escapingpan.wordpress.com/2015/06/27/hello-world/
> Men in their 30s are running around like children, sabotaging relationships and their lives without obligation or thought of consequence. Why?
[1] https://escapingpan.wordpress.com/2015/06/27/hello-world/
I avoided all of that by marrying someone into wreck diving, mountains, the gym etc too :-)
I think this assumes that the Patriarchy is defined as men deciding how things ought to be, when I think that it's more a trench our society fell into and can't figure out how to climb out of.
I believe, rather, that this woman is suffering from opportunity costs for decisions she did not realize she was making at the time. She seems to know the type of mate she wants, which is more than most, though unfortunately for her what she wants went "off the market", for her at least, while she was in graduate school. She wants an educated, intelligent, supportive, successful, committed and sacrificing man in his thirties. These exists in sufficient abundance, it's merely that most of those men are either already in committed, long term relationships with people they met while in their twenties, or are not seeking a woman in her thirties with a settled career. Successful men in their thirties tend to be, by definition, successful and so most of them have already successfully found what they want at that moment, whether that's long term or non-committal.
Being childish and dysfunctional as this piece seems to be about are rather different. There are people like that. I can even think of one, and he's as bad at 50. Most guys have been changing babies, cooking, using vacuums and joining in all the mad juggling act that is a two working with kids household.
You can have responsibilites, kids, and career without having to settle into a life of dull conformity, wearing "old people" clothes and no fun beyond a weekly trip to the shops. Can't you?
I assure you, you can. Want to travel the world with your kids? You can. Want to buy a sailboat and sail the world with your kids? You can. I even know poly couples and swingers who continue to enjoy their romantic/hedonistic lives while raising 2-3 kids, while remaining well adjusted emotionally stable parenting figures.
Your life is what you make of it.
Examples of families adventuring with their kids:
http://www.bumfuzzle.com/ | http://www.sailingtotem.com/ | https://afamilyafloat.com/ | http://www.svwondertime.com/
Or adventuring without kids:
http://traveling-trio.com/ | http://theroadchoseme.com/ (shoutout to HN's /u/grecy)
Or Doug, a DBA in his 50s in Tulsa building a ~73 foot sailboat in his front year: http://www.svseeker.com/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puer_aeternus#Peter_Pan_syndro...
The corollary to that is people who're successful and have a lot of hobbies and have a six pack (the abs kind) probably aren't having time for relationship. She might be looking for a unicorn?
I guess it 's just a roundabout way for me to say that the problem seems to me on her end rather than the world. Even discounted for the potential self-awareness humour bit at the end, the very first paragraph already strikes me as ... a bit off.
(Quoting for reference)
> I am a woman in her 30s living in an exciting and lively urban area. I am successful, intelligent, fiercely independent, hard working, beautiful (by my own standards when I’m not PMSing), and multifaceted. I have a wonderful career, worked hard to pursue and complete graduate level education, and I am sane and stable (subjectively). I play various musical instruments, have an array of interesting and active hobbies, have loyal and loving friends and family, and my charm and wit entertain myself and others to no end. I am a catch. Not to mention, severely humble.
Without the phrase in between those parens, I find the semantic ambiguity very amusing (~_^)
2) Life-long monogamy, even as an aspirational ideal, is on its death bed. Marriage is now about personal satisfaction, instead of duty to spouse and children.
On the other hand I have two girlfriends who are sometimes dating other men and the other guys often end up being idiots, too...
Maybe most people are simply bad at relationships?
Much like the original article (I base my worldview on the opinions of those around me) the problem is internal (she thinks she's a princess) but the blame goes outward (nobody treats her like one).
I guess neither has learned how to be a grown up. Considering the shape society has formed recently, I'm not surprised.
This.
IMO you become an adult when you stop thinking what others should/could do for you and you take responsibility on what you could and should do for someone else.
But some cultures consider that parents are responsability of the sons. Some people include brothers. Some include just women from the family. So, I preferred to mean it in a broader sense.
What the fuck has sexist bitching got to do with hacking? The points system on this site is a joke. 29 points? That comment does not in any way deserve 29 fucking points.
If you take away the mans benefits of a traditional relationship what reason is there for a man to invest in one today? Certainly not the benefits that have existed for the previous hundreds(thousands) of years while our species evolved.
Should men have had those benefits? Perhaps not of course. Doesn't change the fact that they did exist and no longer do. (it's not as if this was a one way street)
There's nothing 'evil' or 'wrong' about identifying that things which previously existed no longer do.
Perhaps there's no acknowledgement of obligation/consequence because none exists anymore, whether that's a good or bad thing is a separate argument.
Here's the equality you wanted. Time to dogfood it.
Well, in today's housing market you need a double income :)
Choosing the couple most extreme cases isn't very interesting.
Not how I feel at all.
But sure, here's a brief summary of tasks previously(generations ago) assigned to almost solely females:
-Household chores
->laundry
->cleaning
->cooking
Again, we're talking about the past here, women today obviously live in a different world where they are empowered.
Do I think women should have to do those things now? Nope.
Did I say they did? Nope.
Do I think women choosing this lifestyle are 'stupid' or not 'empowered enough'? Nope.
Do men owe women anything in this context? Nope.
This is equality. Men have _nothing_ to apologize for or work towards. We are equal.
Exactly what am I afraid of?
Please don't assume that people attack you when asking questions.
Most, if not all, including Indian and Asian women having westernized thinking are sluts to be blunt. Someone had to say it after all. They think that their actions have no consequences. Well, biggest consequence is on their own life.
As a man in my 30s, why would I settle down some used and thrown woman? What incentive do I have to settle down with women like one in the story? If career was so important why not celibate for life?
No one wants them. Where were women like her when I was asking her (or alike) out 5-10 yrs back. Sure,she can have money and sexual freedom but then don't complain saying its mens fault. No, its her fault for believing in feminism and being a slut.Karma is a bitch after all!
Good night. I have to focus on my hobbies now.
> I am a woman in her 30s living in an exciting and lively urban area. I am successful, intelligent, fiercely independent, hard working, beautiful (by my own standards when I’m not PMSing), and multifaceted. I have a wonderful career, worked hard to pursue and complete graduate level education, and I am sane and stable (subjectively). I play various musical instruments, have an array of interesting and active hobbies, have loyal and loving friends and family, and my charm and wit entertain myself and others to no end. I am a catch. Not to mention, severely humble.
Men are into women primarily for one deep ancestral reason: reproduction. Are you willing to drop your successful career, independence, array of interesting hobbies, move into a less exciting area to save money for the next ten years of your life? Are you willing make conceiving, delivering and raising children your new career? I didn't think so. Then don't act so surprised that mature men stay far far away from you. If all you need is someone to cheer how awesome you are, your circle of loyal and loving friends will have to do.
On a deeper level, it saddens me to no end to witness the death of a great civilization. We are here because our ancestors took motherhood seriously. Our culture is poisoning the minds of our generation with distractions and false gods. Our great-great-children may never be conceived. Nobody left to carry on. End of times.
Is this anything more than a conservative's fantasy? From everything I've read, women in general never dedicated their lives to raising children. Either they were poor and had too much work to do, or they had servants to take care of them. This concept of widespread full-time motherhood doesn't seem rooted in any historical reality.
Rich westernized countries, except US, offer between 1 and 3 years of unpaid maternity leave. This is a strong recognition of the critical role mothers play in the early life of their children, and a recognition of the importance of rearing the next generation. Multiply by 2 or 3 children, and you get anywhere between 2 and 9 years of working on the "conceiving, delivering and raising children" career. Of course, it doesn't end when the child is 3 years old, more like when s/he's 18, and sometimes much later.
Furthermore, when women have a real choice between career and family, many choose family. http://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2015/05/ec.... "in the Netherlands 26.8% of men and 76.6% of women work less than 36 hours a week". I, for one, am commending them for it.
Does this mean that women should spend their entire existence attending to their children? By no means! The Dutch arrangement sound fantastic. As an old Dutch friend proudly stated, what Netherlands does today, the rest of the developed world will do in 10-20 years, so there is hope for the rest of us.
As of the lady in the OP, she has her priorities in the wrong place, no surprise adult men stay away from her.