Comment by ap22213 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by ap22213 | Hacker News Reader

IQ has always been a difficult thing for me. I was born into a 3-sigma family to 4-sigma parents. And, on average, we all have lived below average lives.

My parents can barely manage their lives, and I'm the only child (of 4) who was able to finish college. So, I always find the fascination with IQ to be odd.

At 3rd grade, my siblings and I were separated from the rest of the kids and given the gifted label. (Someone once explained that 'gifted' was a cold war program to beat the soviets - idk). We were then given special treatment: small classes, lots of logic puzzles, access to technology and science, lots of field trips etc.

By the end of high school, approximately 25% of my class had already dropped out. But, for some odd reason (probably because obedience - i.e. 'conscientiousness') I succeeded.

Over all of those years, I came to realize that there were kids with high IQ who were smart but even more who were very stupid. Even of the smart ones, many of them seemed to completely lack creativity, intuition, or lateral thinking. And, many were also stricken with major behavioral and learning disabilities.

I realize that there are correlations with IQ to 'success'. But, the IQ club, for me, was really a circle jerk. And, I don't believe that they're somehow more re 'fit'. So, this analysis seems spot on.

Edit: oops, if I had actually read the link, instead of just the headline, I would have seen that it's not 'spot on'. Sorry :-)

The article shows no difference between average and gifted children in emotional and social behaviors. But we must not be deceived by such results because obviously enough no one is "average" in all or even any particular respects.

Having practiced medicine for a long time and working with thousands of people with behavioral/emotional disorders of many kinds, I can assure you that there is no necessary correlation between cognitive capability and "success" measured by any number of criteria.

When life difficulty seems out of phase with ability, it's wise to seek consultation or evaluation to find out if there is a correctable problem. As I've observed countless times, even geniuses (seriously) can have learning disorders, depression, anxiety and attentional disorders. These can be surprisingly disabling, and in many cases appropriate treatment can make a world of difference. I've seen that occur in many instances too.

BTW it is known that conditions of the kind I mention have moderate or strong heritability, so your description of a family characteristic of less success than would be expected may point to traits that "run in the family". All the more reason to check it out. I strongly believe it's never too late to make improvements in one's life, and we always have the obligation to take good care of ourselves.

This. I was in GATE from 4th grade - 8th. Separate classes, separate field trips, produced a daily school news tv show. Most of my gifted classmates became highly involved with drugs in highschool. Few graduated high school, let alone college.

I was in a program like this in 5th and 6th grade. I believe I was among the lowest achievers in the class, both by grades and extra curriculars. Of those I still keep in touch with, I believe I'm still among the lowest achievers - I never finished college, among other things, although I'm certainly doing fine for myself professionally. The class fed to two different high schools so I lost touch with roughly half of my classmates, but as far as I know they all finished high school and all that I know of finished college or university. Just another perspective.

I also had a very different experience, was part of various "gifted" programs from 4th grade until I graduated high school. Many of my classmates are doing extremely well (grad school/consulting/tech) - I don't think problems with these programs are intrinsic. My classmates from high school are on average doing better though, I think there might be some survivorship bias going on.

Same story throughout family and friends who went to gifted class. I think gifted people seem to have extreme outcomes: more drug addicts, more suicide, more success, more power. Developmental orchids compared to the staggering ruggedness of the developmental dandelions out there who keep on trucking no matter what.

That's also my impression of a good chunk of the adults in my limited exposure to Mensa, so I don't think it's just a kid thing.

It's uncommon, there are diminishing returns to IQ, and it is more striking when high IQ people do poorly, but in general the more you have the better off you are.

There is some correlation between success and IQ, but it's absolutely not a given.

If you look at statistics you will see things like 'Average IQ of University Professor is 125 were as average IQ of factory worker is 85'.

That sounds cool and all until you realize that the number of people that work at a university as professors is in the dozens were as the number of people that work at a factory is in the hundreds... and that average IQ spread of factory workers is 70 to 140 and the spread of professors is 110 to 140. These things operate on bell curves.

Which means that there are a lot more high IQ people working at the factory then there are working at the university.

Which means if you want to figure out what people are more likely to succeed in life then you should just ignore IQ and concentrate on what they have already managed to achieve.

I'm not denying that, I'm addressing the common misconception that it becomes a handicap past a certain point, or that it comes at the expense of some other traits.

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