Ask HN: Great online forums? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: Great online forums?

48 pointsffggvv63 comments

Reddit is filled with internal jokes. HN is a big echo-chamber. Lobste.rs is invite-only. Imzy?? (too young maybe?)

Any good forum out there?

I think I can relate to you in that I'd like to find a community to be able to interact more. I've been an active lurker on HN for 4 years now. I learn so much from HN but feel like I'm just eavesdropping on "the smart kids." I love programming & technology as a whole and have been involved since I was a young preteen, but my career path just didn't happen to go that way and I have too much going where I am to change career fields, bittersweet.

However, I've never been somewhere that stays "on topic" so well, so to speak, but then again it's hard to socialize as I don't work in the field and don't have much input that I don't think will make me look stupid.

Here's is how I viewed this history of collaborative forum information online in the last 20 years

Slashdot - aggregating opinions from "experts". allowed comments. Lacked accountability so then came...

Digg - allowed crowd source voting. active interaction. complicated and over-engineered upvote algorithm lead to...

Reddit - community inclusion. more open voting (and down voting). subgroups.

So that's kind of where I see it. What gets improved on? Is there technology that can be improved? Is there a missing idea or improvement? Is there a next generation that could improve status quo?

Many of the default subs on reddit are pretty terrible. It seems like as the number of users increase, the quality goes down.

Reddit also has a problem with "super mods" who are pretty fast an loose with their powers.

These seem to be normal problems with trying to appeal to large groups (lame watered down meme low effort crap) and the effects of power on individuals (bans, shadowbans, bias, agenda pushing, etc)

I am from outside US. I grew up watching American TV shows and movies and had a really positive impression about US and its people. I actually used to look down on my culture and its ways most of the time. The 4 years I spend on Reddit exposed me to so much racism and hatred that I have only negative feelings left now. I am leaving US next month, a good part of my decision was based on those feelings.

How about the people and community you live in vs. random internet assholes who are a small minority of people and exist in your home country too and curated entertainment?

I would argue that your day to day interactions are more indicative of the average person's feelings of racism and hatred than reddit trolls. And if this is the only reason you are leaving the U.S. I would reconsider.

There are so many great subs outside of the defaults. Search around and you may find something that fits! I love /r/cfb and /r/personalfinance, to provide a couple examples. I think I've unsubscribed from just about every default.

The world of online forums is much more diverse than those three. Some of the best forums I've been part of have had very little in the way of voting.

I think traditional forums are different than sites like reddit and digg where votes and participation change what is shown.

Yes, they are different, but they're still actively used, which is why leaving them out seemed odd to me.

I like Something Awful. Outside of its general-purpose forums, it's very good, with plenty of reliable information and well-researched discussion about a large variety of topics.

What I like the most about it is that it costs $10 to join, and if you get banned, you have to pay another $10 to reinstate your account. This keeps the lowest common denominator trolls out and discourages shitposting.

Metafilter is still around and has a great community. http://www.metafilter.com/

I've been on Metafilter for a long time (since the early 2000s -- edit: longer than that, as I just recalled discussing the 2000 US presidential election on there, so it's been quite a while it seems). It was and still is miles ahead of many places on the internet in terms of civility, intelligence, and general knowledge, however it has one very big downside these days: it has gone more or less off the deep end into identity politics. As someone who believes in equality, individuality, and enlightenment values, it's difficult to stomach at times. I basically don't talk on there any more, as I know my viewpoints would not be welcome. I just read, as I still find it informative and valuable. However if you are looking for anything even approaching balanced discussion on certain topics, it's not really a go-to place.

i participated in mefi for over a decade but the smugness and slow but constant leftward drift of the site, including quiet banning of users who signal right in the slightest against what the mods decide is the community consensus on any contentious political issue (especially wrt gender), pushed me away. it's still a useful resource for fresh links but the discussions on political subjects are one of the most intense echo chambers on the internet.

Assuming you aren't a cis-het male, poor or any number of other categories. The place is incredibly misandrist, among other things.

Since this is being downvoted, evidence of some of the misandry there: http://micheleincalifornia.blogspot.com/2014/11/having-sad.h...

And evidence of the ugly classism: http://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/2016/11/as...

I think there are still a few good forums out there but they're specific to a hobby or interest.

This is exactly right.

For electronics, check out http://www.eevblog.com/forum/

For computer hardware, check out https://forums.anandtech.com/

The anandtech forum is terrible. So much half knowledge and toxicity that even your average tech subreddit is a better choice.

That's a shame. Didn't use to be like that. But that site has gone downhill in general since Anand sold it to some big media outlet. (With the exception of a few authors who were around in old times.)

What exactly are you looking for? A "good forum" is one that fits your needs and tastes well. Are you specifically looking for a tech forum? A general interest forum? Something else? What do you want out of it?

As others have said, there are great ones about various niches. People tend to really know each other over time (in a more personal way than your Reddits of the world) and thus find themselves more accountable to each other--but it is still as anonymous as you want.

You get too big of groups or absent or poor mods and things tend to fall apart. Tens of thousands of users is no problem because most users are mostly lurkers anyways.

Quick plug--low odds here, but if you by some chance happen to know the board game Heroscape, have a look at www.heroscapers.com/community for a well functioning, respectful, fun (not modern looking) niche online community. The game has been cancelled for years, but there's still a good chunk of us active. Lots of site activity takes place in various private sections of the site devoted to various projects so you don't see everything happening but the public stuff is representative of how people treat each other there in private.

Imzy is young enough to play a pivotal role in the community. Never underestimate that.

I tried Imzy, and I wanted to like it, I really did.

However, I found it slow, bloated, very unnecessarily political (in a deeply polarising way, which is bad for something that isn't going to be an echo chamber), and the signal to noise was absolutely atrocious.

I get what they were trying to achieve (and I hope things have improved since I left), but I think there's as much a risk of overestimating what Imzy can achieve as there is underestimating.

You should take another look.

With respect, why? Also, why Imzy over somewhere else?

The best online forums are the ones devoted to a topic and run by people who believe in what they're doing. HN, in fact, fits this description to a t. bluelight.org, which I used to moderate, is a great example of how a dedicated community can generate productive discussion even when most of the members are heavy drug users without college degrees. Quora, by contrast, has some of the smartest people from all over the world, but it's hardly a "community" and is susceptible to its own forms of groupthink and political squabbling.

If you're specifically looking for discussion on politics, philosophy, and religion, aka the three things that end up on every forum that isn't about them, I suggest reading books and peer-reviewed journals.

What are your interests?

These are the top forums I visit

Fitness: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/

Computer hardware: http://www.overclock.net/

Camping and outdoorsy stuff: https://campingbabble.com/

Canadian deals site: http://forums.redflagdeals.com/

Mostly about internet but has some good sub-forums: http://www.dslreports.com/

Not sure if you're open to the idea, but I've found that smaller image boards, particularly those with a specific subject matter, often are home to excellent, substantive discussion. The only issue is that once a critical mass is reached (see 8chan, 4chan, et al) productive discussion goes out the window due to the ridiculous pace of conversation and the level of trolling enabled by anonymity and lax rules of engagement.

I won't divulge any specific boards here publicly, but I'd be happy to PM you a nice one.

>"I won't divulge any specific boards here publicly, but I'd be happy to PM you a nice one."

HN doesn't have PMs.

Whoops. Well, I guess there's no harm in posting it on HN: lainchan.org

Knew I'd find a lainon in this thread.

BTW for all the webdev types there's some cool design coming from here, like fauux.neocities.org

To be frank, I dont take any website with "chan" in it seriously.

Think the absolute disgust coming out of 4chan is the reason

That's a shame, and also a quite lazy form of prejudice.

Yes, 4chan and it's analogues are full of worthless shit and the quality has gone to the drain, but they are also full of different & unique people, some of whom share similar ideas that those of the HN community (privacy, anti-mainstream, anti-corpo, etc; but you can also find the polar opposites in either).

It has in the past also acted as one of the few places with freedom of speech (is there anywhere left in the world now? I doubt it. People with that specific "absolute disgust" frame of mind have made them all disappear: "Let's stereotype a whole community based on a vocal negative minority").

It's also a place not only full of internet history, but also responsible for a big part of it.

In fact, there is no doubt you have enjoyed content, trends, breaking news, memes, etc. that were originally created/generated at 4chan. All other forums/communities have and will continue to pick up content from 4chan & others. Not only lazy, but also kinda hypocrite.

I guess that's the whole point of having these different communities. People quick to judge better stay at the mainstream, where everything is Safe. What you get is something like Reddit, which is now (just like 4chan) completely distorted from its original form and fully bought out, and you have admins (the CEO itself...) changing user's post on a personal grudge. Bravo.

If you want free speech go yell about UFOs and gays on the public square where it's protected. Free speech doesn't mean people have to give you a platform. Your version of free speech would actually coerce other people into using their resources to propagate your speech, which doesn't sound free to me.

Arguing 4chan is a positive valuable place because they are good at making memes and organizing raids and harassment campaigns is also pretty funny.

Several of your recent comments to HN have been uncivil. Please post civilly and substantively, or not at all.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

"chan" is simply short for "channel" and is left over from nomenclature used by the original Japanese imageboard users. Nothing nefarious, just a way to identify the site as an imageboard the same way "XyzBlog" would be identified as a blog. It is up to the moderates\users to control the content.

It appears to be a specific style of image board, inspired by the anonymous nature of 2ch. Do you know of any 'channel' style image board that doesn't offer user anonymity?

I thought I'd made myself clear in the original comment, but I'll try again: the issue with these sites is not the "channel"/imageboard format itself, it produces great results at a certain population size. The issue is lax moderation and the greater proportion of highly active bad actors when the site reaches a certain critical mass of users. To generalize your experiences on large, less niche sites like 4chan is to miss out on some of the smaller gems out there that share the imageboard format.

There are many different chans.

7clams (the one before it went public, the one with the good music) was nice.

Lainchan is almost HN-esque. It's a cyberpunk board (sort of), and the moderation is a lot weaker, but there's an emphasis on constructive discussion which is refreshing.

https://lainchan.org/

I enjoy the City Data[0] forums. It's interesting to read about other cities and locations across the country and across the world, and to read about the thoughts and concerns of the locals. Very often there will be people posting who are thinking about moving to your city and who are asking for help and advice as they contemplate and implement their move. It's rewarding to field these kinds of questions and be able to help out.

[0] http://www.city-data.com/forum/

For programming and IT-related reckless fun and hilarious rants I recommend https://what.thedailywtf.com.

If you happen to play keyboards: http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/forums/18/1/The...

Would love to have you trying HelloBox [disclaimer - I run it]. HelloBox was originally designed as "Create your own HN" and has now become an online tool for creating and managing communities. If you can't find a community that you like, often the best approach is to create one! Would love to help you out along the way.

https://www.hellobox.co

Try our community/voting platform at Snapzu (http://www.snapzu.com). Would love any feedback or to answer any questions. Cheers!

http://arstechnica.com/civis/ which I've lurked on since its inception and have always liked it.

I don't use it and it's slashdot era, but maybe metafilter?

Many, but mostly special interest, mostly around hobbies. Reddit, Lobste.rs and HN aren't really forums in my view. (reddit comes closest, but still has this focus on short-term threads and voting that is different from what I think of as a good forum. Classic phpbb has its strengths)

What fields are you interested in?

We're building forum software and experience over at Baqqer. If you're into building, sharing, and collaborating with other makers, it might be your cup of tea.

Usenet. Great newsgroups on every subject.

You can get an account on www.eternal-september.org or news.solani.org.

Voat.co seems like a promising Reddit alternative. Less censorship for certain, definitely not shill-proof however.

Solving the problem of shills/astroturfers is IMO the most difficult and important challenge in accommodating public online discussion moving forward.

I don't remember if it was Voat or if it was another one of those "Reddit alternatives without censorship" but the last time I visited which ever of them it was, it was full of conspiracy theories and racism. All noise and no signal.

Can you define those terms for those of us who are unaware?

Yes an astroturfer aka shill I would personally define as someone portraying themselves to be a neutral observer/participant when in reality they are paid/sponsored/incentivized by a state, company, or organization pushing a specific agenda. They are intentionally planted to deceive, distort and sway those unsuspecting of such activity. There is an excellent TED talk [0] on the subject.

The problem is rampant and while not new, the recent election cycle has highlighted it greatly.

Propaganda does not spread just from 'fake news' or a heavily biased corporate media. It is co-ordinated & perpetuated online. The links and comments on Reddit and HN are prime mediums to infiltrate and carry this out.

[0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bYAQ-ZZtEU

> The links and comments on Reddit and HN are prime mediums to infiltrate and carry this out.

I don't know about Reddit but we see comparatively little on HN that appears suspicious once we look at the data (e.g. which users have voted on a post). Anyone who suspects astroturfing on HN is welcome to email us so we can look into the matter—which we always do—but not to accuse other users directly, because both the odds and the cost of an unfair accusation are much higher than people realize when they do that.

I listened to that talk you linked to. At the end the speaker mentions four "hallmarks of astroturfing": (1) use of inflammatory language; (2) use of charged language to "debunk myths"; (3) attacking an issue by controversializing the people around it rather than addressing the facts; (4) reserving all public skepticism for those exposing wrongdoing rather than wrongdoers. It seems to me HN is in pretty good shape here: the first three violate the site guidelines, and the fourth seems rather rare and is not received well by the community.

Maybe there are astroturfers getting away with it on HN. If they exist, though, they're being clever about it, so we'd be interested in anything the community can figure out. Just please don't accuse each other directly without real evidence.

Thanks. The more you know...

Swintonreport.com for political discourse.

I tried Imzy, but I can't like it. It's not forum-ey enough, draws too strongly from social networks: if your forum looks like a social media site, you won't have good discussion: that interface isn't optimized for it.

a.f.p on the usenet (that's alt.fan.pratchett for the uninitiated) used to be good, but it seems to be nearly dead now. :-(.

Bits of reddit are good. I love /r/adventofcode this time of year (although that's seasonal and event-specific).

If you're looking for proper, real, actual forums, I can reccomend a few. The xkcd forums are still excellent, give or take. If you like dwarf fortress, the bay12forums are good.

And onto the chans: much maligned as they are.

4chan's /tg/ is shockingly good if you like tabletop games (WH40K in particular): it's a blue board, so it's not totally flooded with porn constantly, and it's also got a decent community and isn't horrifically acidic, unlike, say, /g/.

Also, even if you don't like the chan, the wiki, 1d4chan, has a tvtropes-like stickiness about it, essentially being a best-of reel of the entire community. You should at least read The Tale of Old Man Hnderson, as it is one of the most famous in all of RPing.

7chan (http://7chan.org) was created as a reaction to 4chan, and it shows. Posting quality is enforced, and the mods are quite punishing. But as a result, quality is reasonable, AFAICT (although I am not a regular)

Sushichan (https://sushigirl.us) is a "relaxed" chan.

And than there's Lainchan.

Lainchan is a cyberpunk chan (sort of). It also has a strong programming and anime focus (with a name like lainchan, would you expect anything else?) It bears a semblance to HN in some ways, but it's a chan, make no mistake, and quite different in others. Just go look if you're interested.

Of additional interest is lainzine (https://lainzine.neocities.org), lainchan's official unofficial magazine. The typical immidiate reaction to lainzine, AFAICT, is "what the hell did I just read?" and I speak no hyperbole in saying that it is like nothing else on the internet.

2009 era luelinks

Spacebattles

neogGAF for video games

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