Hacker News Reader

Comment by user5994461 | Hacker News Reader

Java reigns supreme because there is nothing which come close to its characteristics in terms of capabilities, libraries supports, tooling, performances, easiness to learn, simplicity and maturity.

If you want faster or lower level, you gotta move to C++, which is uber-hardcore in terms of non-simplicity and impossible-to-learn.

If you want easier, you gotta move to python/ruby/node.js, which are a joke in terms of performance and concurrency, with the last 2 being fairly young and immature (< 10 years).

Either way, the tooling sucks compared to Java, if not entirely non existent.

Entreprisey development is on Java because that's what best for them. Web development is on something else because they pick what's cool and trendy.

View on HN

Ruby came out in 1995, 22 years ago. It is neither young nor immature.

Of course I mean ruby on rails when I say ruby.

Initial release 2005. i.e. Young.

Are you using Struts or something?

How could a 12-year-old framework not be old enough for you?

Ruby on Rails is a web framework, not a language. Also web dev is about shipping a product fast, that's why you don't see Java there.

You do see a ton of Java web apps in in-house and consultant-built line of business applications. Just not so much from product companies.

Once you know whatever java framework well enough and your project is not something ruby on rail spits out immediately, shipping fast is not a problem. In 4 months timeframe, you can definitely produce more or as much as with node.js or something like that.

The issue is that you wont do good frontend in it (obviously), java programmers are more expensive, learning it well enough so that you can actually be that fast takes a lot of time and hosting is way more expensive. Learning language itself is easy, but absorbing necessary frameworks takes time. Moreover, people who are good in frontend prefer languages similar to javascript, because they already know it very well so those are easier to learn for them.

I think this is why it does good in enterprise - they have money to throw at hardware, most projects are under huge time pressure constantly and requirements change constantly. Frontend is super important for product, but not so much for enterprise.

How is Java easy to learn, you need a huge IDE, I don't know how many SDKs or dependables and two pass compilation and 1000 layers of abstraction, ...

Try these languages in order of ascending difficulty: C, assembly, Delphi, Ada, C++

After that, you'll understand that Java is on the spectrum of "easy" programming languages.

The IDEs are very helpful by the way. You only need one SDK, which is a single download.

Ide makes learning easier and faster instead of harder. You dont have to care about compiler passes, ide compiles seamlessly.

But yeah, learning java ecosystem well enough takes a lot of time for someone who is just starting and you have to be comfortable with abstract thinking.

That is due to maturity / age, and at one point Java was the new kid on the block.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com