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Comment by tbyehl | Hacker News Reader

I'm starting to wonder if these articles are driven by a PR firm paid by John Deere's competition. They're always about John Deere and only John Deere. Aside from the Motherboard / Vice article, they never provide any specifics about the maintenance or repair operations that farms are prevented from doing on their own.

With the Vice article, 2 of the 3 things they mention are modifying the tractors to operate in ways the manufacturer did not intend which could result in damage.

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John Deere has a crazy high market share overall...Close to 80%. And it goes up as you move up market to larger, more expensive models.

I think it's just the same reason Google bashing is more prevalent than Bing bashing.

Based on some poking around, it appears that the focus is mainly on John Deere because it's mainly John Deere imposing these software restrictions.

Relevant thread on The Combine Forum (because that's a thing, apparently):

http://www.thecombineforum.com/forums/31-technology/239314-w...

Yep.

That's also because their software is crazy advanced. Basically automates the whole plowing and such. Big market differentiator.

>They're always about John Deere and only John Deere. Aside from the Motherboard / Vice article, they never provide any specifics about the maintenance or repair operations that farms are prevented from doing on their own.

John Deere essentially is the entire market for these machines. Especially in the US.

Case IH has a decent foothold in the US, not anywhere near John Deere but it's there. Unfortunately, they're pulling the same bullshit from what I can tell - it's to the point where farmers that aren't part of a co-op or running a large commercial operation where equipment is leased or replaced regularly it's impractical to use new equipment should it break down.

I'd like to see some concrete examples as well. What kind of repairs are you unable to do?

I've had the same thought. It's such a niche issue and really it's incredibly standard for any kind of business hardware, which is what tractors are. Also nobody's being forced to buy new tractors, there's tons of old tractors still out and running and working every day.

So why do these articles appear with such regularity?

(To be clear I think that all software should be open source and vendors should charge for support, but that's beside the point here.)

> Also nobody's being forced to buy new tractors, there's tons of old tractors still out and running and working every day.

There are also fewer every day.

It's true but I would wager independent farmers are more likely to repair and keep old tractors around, or buy used when they do have to buy one.

I bet the biggest buyer of new tractors are the farming conglomerates, and I wonder if they're behind these articles. Trying to get a grass roots movement going to push John Deere to change these practices?

You'd be surprised how long old, robust vehicles live for. I don't have any clear data for tractors, but older trucks that can be repaired with minimum tooling get used and re-used in places in Africa, almost to no end.

This is not so relevant for modern agriculture, but my family still has the Valmet 361D tractor my father bought in 1963. It runs as good as ever. The diesel engine needed to have the cylinder tubes replaced some 30 years ago, and other mechanical parts do wear out and are replaced, but this thing isn't going to be out of use because of software issues.

It's too small to be very useful in modern farming, though.

The only reason why things are scrapped is when the price of repairing starts to exceed the value of the product. In places where labor is cheaper and products are more expensive, you see more of a repair culture. Cars is one of those examples - if you've got some basic repair skills, you can keep a car running for a long time. Getting or making parts can be challenging, but not unsolvable. The problem of course is that a lot of work is done by garages or repairmen, who will charge an hourly rate relative to the standard of living here. or something.

Ergo, if a repair costs $1000 for a car worth $1000 it's not worth it, if that same repair costs just $100 it is.

You sure nobody is being forced to buy new ones? That would be true if new ones offer no competitive advantage. If there is an advantage, then farmers trying to increase output or reduce cost might have to go for new tractors.

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