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Comment by J-dawg | Hacker News Reader

I haven't been able to find it, but I remember a comment here on HN by a guy who basically said that gaming saved his life by helping him to zone out during a period of severe depression.

I guess it's a form of mindfulness, in a way.

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I'm pretty sure Kerbal Space Program was the lynchpin upon which my sanity hung during a pretty dark period some time ago induced by a serious medical condition of a close family member and sudden passing away of few others during a period of two years.

That's the dangerous pattern. A single event in isolation you can cope with but if things hit hard in succession it can really strip you of resilience, a mental form of being punch drunk.

That's the exact opposite actually. Nit saying it's a bad thing though. But it's important to understand that screens are taking your attention away. You are not in the moment at all.

Would you be willing to elaborate on that a bit? Once upon a time, i played a few competitive games. I'd have to be very aware of my emotional state. Being aware of a sort of sick feeling when i'm falling behind, recognizing that that exists and not letting it affect my play seems like what people mean when they speak of mindfulness. And the converse, not getting cocky when pulling ahead. I also dealt with the random chemical changes of adrenaline. My hands get very cold and a little sweaty, heart races a bit. But that's just a thing that happens. being aware of it, acknowledging it and moving on with what i choose to do next seems like a mindful practice.

But maybe you mean something more sophisticated?

Maybe OP means the eu-stress from gaming is neglectable compared to the emotional trauma described. Getting used to and thinking that's normal stress might numb rather than build mindfulness, because just doing it frequently doesn't promise improvement. EG repetitive strain might hinder that. And it might be distractive in general.

That's a really good point. the gaming i talked about was in a pretty stable time in my life, more or less every other aspect of my life was working smoothly. Thanks!

I'm just a beginner since I've been meditating for only 8 years but from my experience, most video games involve at least one of the following:

- ego

- loosing track of time

- loosing track of physical reality, such as bodily sensations

- reacting

- desiring an outcome

- judging

Not all of them, and not for all video games. But any of those characteristic seems to be something quite antagonist with mindfulness.

Now somebody that is very focused, very selfless and equanimous in a competitive game will have something close to meditation. But first they are rare, and secondly the very existence of the game, being virtual and... a game, seems to be orthogonal the mindful state state.

I'm not a competitive player though, and:

- when I play dota I react A LOT.

- when I'm coding or watching a movie, I completely forget reality.

It contrast a lot with my meditation practice. Maybe some people are better at dealing with screens that I am.

I agree with that, you are completely taken out of your actual context, or at least I am.

I used to game really heavily during a pretty terrible period (divorce + grad school) in an attempt to cope. Of course it actually just made things worse overall while distracting my brain to make it seem temporarily better, it diverted a lot of the energy I might have used towards engaging and fixing the problems.

When I game severely (FPS shooters are my crack) I can get focused for a dozen hours at a time. My body almost shuts down, I get into a trancelike state and my metabolism recedes. I forget to eat, I don't get tired. When I finally do sleep I will wake up the next day and actually have a headache until I play again for a little while. It was that kind of physical withdrawal that made me realize long ago how pernicious it was, at least for my particular physiology and brain. Now I will only play games like that in a social setting, never alone lest I fall back into that spell.

One time in grad school I stayed up all night gaming and I slept through my alarm. I missed an exam. That I was proctoring. I went straight to a pawn shop and sold my console when I realized what I was doing to myself.

> I forget to eat, I don't get tired.

Sound like dopamine at play!

Sounds like how I feel when writing code.

I don't agree. As I understand these things:

You are mindful and react on direct stimulus - while gaming, you do not think on future or past, you are immersed in your actual activity - it IS mindfulness.

BUT it does not improve mindfulness - it is easy to be mindful at interesting times - that's normal, but not so when nothing interesting is around, and you are just left alone with your own thoughts or problems. Thats what various mindfulness practices trying to improve - to be mindful in common "boring" or bad situations too.

And like for any improvements you usually have to make some effort - not just do something when it is natural.

> You are mindful and react on direct stimulus - while gaming, you do not think on future or past, you are immersed in your actual activity - it IS mindfulness.

I disagree. Reacting is the polar opposite of what mindfulness is about. Mindfulness is about, among other things, responding appropriately to what is happening, not reacting.

What you're describing, the state people get in when playing computer games, is a state of hyper-vigilance. Acute-awareness of what's directly in front of you induced by a simulated battle.

Not all games are shooters that stimulate fight or flight reflexes.

It's true that games require player agency and thus by definition are active. However, your characterization of games using terms as "hyper", "acute" and "battle" is rather limited and outdated. Games that underplay or avoid challenge and focus on exploration, immersion or rhythm, can offer a state of mind and activity as conducive to mindfulness as walking or swimming.

What are some games that best exemplify a focus on exploration, immersion or rhythm?

Ico, Journey, No Man's Sky, and RiME most recently worked wonderfully for me. Certain "grinding" activities in MMOs like WoW would count too.

Rhythm is easy. Dance Dance Revolution, Guitar Hero, Rocksmith are three mega-popular ones. As a hybrid between standard action/rpg type games and rhythm games, Crypt of the Necrodancer is a phenomenal game.

Exploration is harder -- I can't think of any off the top of my head that have absolutely no combat component. However, that's pretty much how I play Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild. I've barely been engaging in the combat aspect of it, choosing mostly to just roam and explore and climb and enjoy the view.

I absolutely agree with what you've written here.

My exposure to gaming has been almost entirely seeing other people play FPSs.

Thinking about it, the most recent game I played was http://play.quantumgame.io/ which is none of those things I characterised games as.

Thanks for calling me out.

> you are immersed in your actual activity - it IS mindfulness

No it's not - it's called "flow", a state where you lose your reflective self-consciousness (i.e. the core of mindfulness).

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