I could make the same point about children, FWIW. Most children are rowdy annoying and don't keep to themselves even after being instructed to do so by their owners. Should children be banned from all restaurants?
There are more than 1 million restaurants in the United States and the majority of them welcome families with children.
So much this. Kids won't appreciate the wine pairing. Reservations increased. I'd love more options for 21 dining, and I'm obviously not alone in this. I really don't understand the outage at establishments which choose to enforce these types of rules when there are so many other places to go.
There's room for both, but my tongue in cheek point was supposed to be that dogs tend to be better behaved in bars/restaurants (in my anecdotal experience)
I also live in Edinburgh, and my experience is the same as maccard's.
> Should children be banned from all restaurants?
I wouldn't have a problem with that. Kidding aside, as much as some people would like to suggest otherwise, dogs are not people. Children are, and IMO that gives them more of a leg to stand on when bringing them places where dogs might not be allowed, even if dogs are likely to be more trainable than children (even if, in my experience, most dog owners I see have done an abysmal job at training their dogs).
Children are obviously different, because they're a necessary part of a functioning society. Banning parents from all places not explicitly designed for children seems cruel and, in more practical terms, will further reduce the number of people willing to shoulder the burdens of parenthood.
I'm also convinced that children derive great benefits from spending time in the company of adults other than their parents. To quote one of the Greeks: "It takes a village to raise a child".
Yes, you can make an argument for human self-extinction. But that's a separate debate.
Have you seen idiocracy?
> an argument for human self-extinction
I don't follow this logic. Are you saying that by excluding children from restaurants we would increase the risk of human extinction?
If children are misbehaving a parent can speak to them sternly and discipline them in a language they are able understand. And often times a parent will take a child outside until they calm down.
Have you ever watched the futility and absurdity of a dog owner tell a dog to stop barking?
I've seen people successfully halt their dog from barking outside (by issuing commands, or a tap on the nose) and I have watched (with deepest sympathy - I don't begrudge it at all, some day it'll be me) the futility of some parents trying to calm a screaming kid.
If someone doesn't like dogs in restaurants on the basis of hygeine or allergies then I understand, but noise would be a really weird reason.
Yes for example, almost anywhere where there is al fresco seating in New York City will have dogs owners who bring their dogs along and invariably one of those dogs will start barking as there's shortage of stimulus. It is not at all uncommon.
see:
If you can't, you shouldn't be a dog owner.
Children have much more personality. I am of the belief that this should be the case with kids too with proper parenting, but I've seen what I think is good parents with misbehaving kids and vice versa, and I'm not a parent (yet), so there I'm less sure.
I've definitely witnessed the futility in arguing with tiny humans, but never with dogs. Dogs are happily subservient.
Agreed, but the key word here is "eventually." Humans are more complex and seem to require more reinforcement learning in some behaviors.
Sometimes there's just no quick calming down a three-year-old despite best efforts.
If they are rowdy, and it is not a place designed for children; Yes.