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Comment by Faaak | Hacker News Reader

For example with certificates on a national card, like spain or estonia.

Are you being sarcastic?

https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/04/estonia-freezes-resident...

A cryptographic bug that potentially weakens key generation is a much better problem to have than a sequential shared secret.

National ID card would be a non-starter in the USA.

Don’t make it required.

It’s your right to live without one.

You just can’t get on a plane, get a drivers license, get your tax refund or get a student loan without it.

> For example with certificates on a national card, like spain or estonia.

There is so much wrong with a national identity card. For example, who will pay for it? I don't want to pay for it. I don't want my taxes to pay for it. Even if you find some way to pay for it, I don't want it. What's next? Will you require me to carry a identity card on me at all times? "Random" cavity search for people walking down the road?

But then you seem to be willing to pay for the fraudulent debt in your name due to identity theft.

> But then you seem to be willing to pay for the fraudulent debt in your name due to identity theft.

We can solve this problem by requiring lenders to be responsible for the debt they issue. Their word against mine? Debt is invalid.

> Even if you find some way to pay for it, I don't want it.

Sounds like you are not open to discussing this.

Also, what does a national ID card have to do with "cavity searches"?

Edit: I understand the American insistence on reducing the reach of the federal government. What I don't understand is how many of those same people are fine with allowing Congress to screw us all over on important issues like healthcare and taxation...

> Sounds like you are not open to discussing this.

Should I be open to discussing everything? Why? Personally, as long as this Congress is in session I think we should block every single new legislative idea because I can't trust it to do anything right.

> What I don't understand is how many of those same people are fine with allowing Congress to screw us all over on important issues like healthcare and taxation...

I don't either. Which is why I think they will manage to mismanage this. Remember, getting health care dot gov up and running took heroic efforts of a lot of people. Just something simple as getting a dot gov website (department of education to be exact) took years. The Path station at World Trade Center was 100% over budget at FOUR BILLION DOLLARS. Nobody cares. It isn't my problem, right? We talk about net neutrality and how we gave over $400B to telecoms to deploy fiber across the nation (which to their credit, they did but what about the last mile?). And about health care, I am sorry but Obamacare doesn't even go far enough to call it an achievement. Apparently, even Germany spends less (as a portion of its GDP) on healthcare than we do. This is insane. The main point of the matter is costs have to come down. People get mad when I say while minimum wages should go up, wages and salaries in general should come down. Credits and deductions should go away when it comes to taxes. Yet, the people who want a "simplified" tax code get up in arms when they can't deduct their house or their car from their income... Why can't I deduct my rent? Why can't I deduct my cost of commute? Why should I? There is no rhyme or reason when it comes to taxes. It seems like it is just about who can push their way through...

Should I be open to discussing everything? Why?

Why not? If an idea can't withstand a debate, that says a lot about the idea.

If you're in the US, you already have a national ID. The SSN. Because everyone uses it like that. This would just be a much more secure way of having a unique number for your person.

And if keeping citizens secure is not the job of the government and thus paid for with taxes, then what is?

You seem to be talking emotionally instead of rationally. But I suppose you already have a passport or a drivers licence (what if you don't drive ?). Then you just add a chip to it. This chip generates its own keys and then you can authenticate yourself with it.

Passport has an RFID chip in it. State DL typically do not though.

European ID cards do as well.

What relationship does providing citizens a way to identify themselves, sign documents, to having cavity searches ... can you show how providing a nationwide digital certificate scheme leads direct to random cavity searches??

It's like if someone says "I fancy Chinese takeaway" and you don't want any you say "enjoy your cavity search" as if that's a natural outcome.

Explain.

Moreover, how is identifying yourself to the police bad? Sure if you live in a fascist dictatorship, but in a Western democracy?

> Moreover, how is identifying yourself to the police bad? Sure if you live in a fascist dictatorship, but in a Western democracy?

Do we even live in the same country? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop-and-frisk_in_New_York_Cit...

No, we don't live in the same country; welcome to the internet.

I genuinely can't see what your point is about Stop-and-Frisk?l

Thanks for proving most of the objections to a national ID card are mostly fallacies instead of actual arguments

"I don't want to pay" is not a valid reason. I would not like to pay taxes but that's not how things work

You don't get to choose what your taxes goes to.

I am from a country with national ID cards and yes people are required to carry it on themselves at all time if they are outside.

It's mostly used to check your identity if the police stops you while driving, which is a little annoying because surely they could just check that electronically, but it's probably a legacy system. You also use it to verify your age when buying alcohol because driving license is not a valid form of ID.

It's not really a problem, I have mine in my wallet and never take it out, it's been sitting there for years. You can only really get in trouble if you don't have it while driving, and in that case I probably won't have my driving license either because it's in my wallet as well.

> people are required to carry it on themselves at all time if they are outside

... while in other contries there is an ongoing discussion about whether it is against the Constitution to (begin to) require to show an ID when voting!

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