Comment by eesmith | Hacker News Reader

Comment by eesmith | Hacker News Reader

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Not quite 20 years ago I did my first consulting work in Europe. I was concerned as I did not have business clothes. I had only worked for and consulted for companies in the western part of the US. I knew that European dress standards were higher than the US, and even that East Coast standards were higher. When I visited my sister's then-Big-Five company she had me change my socks as I apparently wasn't dressed up enough.

So I went out and bought some new clothes. Not business shirt/jacket/slacks/etc. but still a button down shirt instead of T-shirt or polo shirt.

Now, this was Sweden, which I visited for a couple of years for this consulting project. Towards the end of the years, I talked to one of my co-workers about me having to buy new clothes. He was quizzical. "But in Sweden we dress down compared to other countries."

My reply - "Exactly. And I had to dress a step higher than I usually do."

As you can tell, I'm not an East Coast person. I visited NYC once in fall, and was surprised that I was the only one wearing a white T-shirt. The same sister commented that it was after Labor Day, and in that part of the country they don't really wear white once summer ends.

> I visited NYC once in fall, and was surprised that I was the only one wearing a white T-shirt. The same sister commented that it was after Labor Day, and in that part of the country they don't really wear white once summer ends.

This isn’t really a thing. Plenty of people wear white sweaters, coats, etc. in winter.

That visit was 15 years ago.

Style do change. As https://edition.cnn.com/style/article/labor-day-white-fashio... writes (in 2016):

> More recently, fashion magazines have moved away from the rule and regularly put out suggestions on how to wear fall and winter whites. A 2011 People poll shows nearly 60% of respondents would totally wear white after Labor Day, and 30% would consider it, depending on the outfit. That means only about 10% of people thought white was totally verboten.

That poll shouldn't be taken as anything more meaningful than to get an idea that it was a thing for some people, even recently.

Do you have a better explanation for why I didn't see anyone wearing white in early October in NYC?

> "But in Sweden we dress down compared to other countries."

That's very surprising to me. To me, the Swedish think more about their looks than any other country.

I don't think they are contradicting statements. My impression is that Sweden is more casual, but also more calculated, while continental Europeans are more formal but just throw on a suit and are done with it.

This is basically any trendy city though - you could say the same thing about Brooklyn or Paris.

In a business environment.

Compare https://duckduckgo.com/?q=sweden+business+office&t=ffsb&iax=... with https://duckduckgo.com/?q=germany+business+office&t=ffsb&iar... .

The people in the Germany pictures are more likely to be wearing a dress shirt. The people who wear a business jacket in the Sweden pictures are less likely to be wearing a tie.

My experience is also that people (or at least managers) in the UK also tend to wear suits, with ties, more than in Sweden.

Wearing a suit is only weakly correlated with dressing well or caring about your looks. Someone wearing jeans and a t-shirt can appear better dressed and more caring about their looks than someone wearing a suit.

Well, .... yes.

I was explaining that my use of "dress down" was in a business context. And it's not like I have a pan-European experience. My account was a chance to tell an anecdote which supported the OP's views.

In an environment where it's expected/acceptable to come in a lousy suit, someone caring about their looks and well dressed in nice jeans and t-shirt would be considered absolutely inappropriately dressed and would be requested to "dress up" next time.

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