Comment by mlindner | Hacker News Reader

Comment by mlindner | Hacker News Reader

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What is the metric for determining what data gets through when there is more data than what the transiting connection can handle? The internet is not one single network. It's a series of interconnected network that are operated under different policies and owned by various companies.

I'm assuming you have an understanding of BGP and peering. When peering is established between companies there's a general understanding that peering is free if the data flow in each direction is approximately equal. It's a mutual benefit so both engage in the peering. If however data is predominantly flowing in one direction (early Netflix for example) then companies are eating costs (Netflix's costs) to continue to provide Netflix's data to their customers. If you force ISPs to peer in these sorts of arrangements (Net Neutrality) you are shifting costs from Netflix on to the ISPs. ISPs then need to charge their customers more even if they are not customers of Netflix. This was eventually fixed historically by forcing Netflix to to pay for peering despite the large outrage at the time about Comcast "throttling Netflix" and then "forcing them to pay to stop throttling" which misrepresented what was going on.

This is just one example.

In most cases, ISPs give (sometimes vastly) asymmetric pipes to their customers. It’s disingenuous for them to then turn about and talk about the disparity of data flows on those pipes as if it was some surprise.

Similarly, do you believe Backblaze, cloud backup services, should be able to scream unfairness at those same ISPs?

After all, as asymmetric as flows from Netflix are, then so too are all these ISP customers sending them vast amounts of data?

And don’t think you can use the “but backup providers -knew- this” argument to say they should be eating these costs - guess who else knew?

I think that the points you make are not trivial or inconsequential. I'd be very interested to read more about the challenges that face communications companies that facilitate networks, if you'd be willing to provide references to a few items, such as:

'a general understanding that peering is free ...' - (might this be spelled out in the business service contracts between Comcast and a provider such as Netflix?)

a metric for how to determine and verify by both parties how much data is predominantly flowing and in which direction

And if these details to an agreement had been discussed and agreed upon by some parties that later entered a public debate about them, I might also wonder:

if a metric is determined for how an ISP will route traffic, how will it identify and share how much traffic it can handle, and how much it has received?

What peer relationships is Comcast, or any other ISP, also bound by of similar terms that might connect a candidate business to remote customers that the ISP does not directly service, further along on the internet? How will this also impact the ability of an individual customer or business to make decisions on the terms described above?

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