California weighs toughest net neutrality law in US with ban on paid zero-rating | Hacker News Reader

California weighs toughest net neutrality law in US with ban on paid zero-rating

arstechnica.com

86 pointsrbanffy21 comments

As much as I would have preferred nationwide neutrality, this piecemeal approach may create a testbed for which policies have which outcomes. We will be able to monitor prices, speed, and infrastructure investments in different states. Then find the one that best benefits consumers and make that the nationwide policy.

Or, more likely, these ultra-jurisdictional corporations will just punish the states without neutrality by making them subsidize the costs of doing business in places with stricter laws.

I'm thinking the other way around. Telecoms will have incentive to not invest at all in states with stricter laws. Then in a few years they can say "See, it stifles innovation!"

> I'm thinking the other way around. Telecoms will have incentive to not invest at all in states with stricter laws. Then in a few years they can say "See, it stifles innovation!"

That's gonna be hard for them; Rural areas are inherently more expensive to provide internet infrastructure to (you have to transmit the data much further for each customer) and the current economic situation is such that rural residents have less money; even if they demanded the same level of telecom service we demand here in the more urban areas, they simply can't pay what we can pay.

Add to this the fact that the demand for good telecom services is going to be dramatically higher in technological centers, and I think that telecom companies are gonna have a hard time favoring the red states over the blue, no matter how much they might want to.

I think it's far too late in this case, they've already invested in building out the infrastructure in CA.

Additionally, it could point to active malfeasance if they start to selectively not rollout in CA.

I don't think it would be too hard for a lawyer to pick apart any argument that the rules are that onerous that they can't upgrade in one populated state/city compared to another in another state. If anything it would make it easier to prove they're being disingenuous about upgrades I would think.

Even more likely, create a cross-jurisdictional confusion soup where it's impossible to develop a product, or if you manage, impossible to prosecute or understand.

Even the simplest cloud based activity can involve dozens of service providers and actors, each possibly in a different jurisdiction or country. Buy stock in aspirin.

I wonder how they'll interpret the law w.r.t. free zero-rating. For example, T-Mobile zero-rates Netflix for free, and shows on Netflix start to prominently use T-Mobile products. No money changes hands. Will this be illegal in the future?

T-mobile zero rates any legal video streaming service that complies with its guidelines no payments required The whole argument about zero rating is that it hurts competition. But, it puts everyone on a level playing field. The service signs up with t-mobile, t-mobile limits the stream to SD and everyone wins - the customer gets unlimited video from the provider of their choice and gets cheaper data plans, t-mobile gets to manage network congestion, and the providers services are more attractive.

> shows on Netflix start to prominently use T-Mobile products

That’s payment in kind.

Only if it's agreed. If it just happens without any deal taking place, it's not really payment.

You need a really good lawyer along with a very friendly judge & jury to prove that so happened two companies to facilitate each other so blatantly.

On the other hand, you'd need a public prosecutor who's willing to go to bat against the really good lawyers of Netflix and T-Mobile, combined.

> ... T-Mobile zero-rates Netflix for free ...

Do we know that Netflix isn't paying T-Mobile for this? Or bartering, perhaps?

It’s not just Netflix. It’s their binge on program that zero-rates any site that adheres to their video streaming specs. I complained to them about it as I would love to have my sites included but didn’t really pursue further. If anything T-Mobile is paying Netflix since they provide free memberships to some subscribers.

Did you email the appropriate contact info on their site? I had no problem facilitating several public radio streamers to get their traffic zero rated.

No, they gave me a phone number and email but I just didn’t bother. Was more curious to see if a small guy could even get the info to begin with.

Happy to help if you want to try. Contact info in my profile.

With paid zero rating, t-mobile can start a streaming service with unlimited usage for a fee/ads right?

Awesome.

Unless it reigns in Google and other big tech companies, whats the point?

This has the exact opposite effect. It bolsters the tech companies in their negotiations against ISPs.

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