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Comment by artursapek | Hacker News Reader

I manage a team of roughly 10 devs and I have seen them one at a time get pissed off at their MB Pro and ask to switch to using a Linux machine. The keyboard is always the biggest complaint. I even made our company change its onboarding process to offer the option of buying a Windows laptop and installing some distro of Linux on it instead of just giving everyone a Mac (which they and the rest of Silicon Valley have been doing for years).

I bought my first Thinkpad when I checked out the new MB Pros when they came out in Fall of ‘16. I was so disgusted by the keyboard that I went home and bought my X1 Carbon and learned how to set up a Linux machine (surprisingly easy!)

Apple has really lost its way. They’re selling eye candy now, not work machines.

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Do y'all just work on laptops, or do you usually plug in the laptop to an external monitor/keyboard/screen, then use the laptop solely when in meetings/away from your desk?

I couldn't imagine using the new Macbook's keyboard full-time - I've broken the keys (in half) on the 2015 Macbook repeatedly just by typing. For now - and this seems to be the feeling around me, better to use an external keyboard for most of the time.

I personally cannot even touchtype of the 15" keyboard on the new Macbooks, as it differs ever so slightly, but too much from my 13" at home. I'm already mentally-mapping out four other keyboards I work on. I may not be able to do a fifth!

> I've broken the keys (in half) on the 2015 Macbook repeatedly just by typing

What? How?? Like are you just an extremely heavy typist or what?

I've been using my 2017 15-inch MBP for probably multiple hours a day (on average) since August, and I've had no problems. I get that there's a fair amount of luck involved there, but I don't understand how you can literally break the keys just by typing.

"typing" (banging) on them too hard. I have very large, very strong hands, I guess.

The keyboard did develop a separate (but related) issue though: certain key presses weren't being registered, unless I really pressed down HARD. No amount of cleaning seemed to help. I just thought something wrong with my fingers/hands, from typing so much in my life! Was I developing a working disability, akin to carpel tunnel or something?

It was only when I replaced the keyboard in full did I realized my slowness and difficulty in typing was the keyboard, and not me! My WPM count went up almost 2x. I enjoyed writing for pleasure, again.

It is a remote company; our devs are all over the world. So people travel and move around a lot, and as a result use their laptops “naked” a lot of the time. One guy on my team likes to set up a desk in a forest and work outside most of the day using cellular internet.

Maybe it matters less in a co-located space where everyone is at a desk all day.

Nice. Yeah, I can't ever seeing using the new Macbook 15" remotely. It seems so very fragile.

I've taken my 2012, 2013, and 2015 Macbooks on full on offroad bicycle trips without a problem, but the current crop just seems to tip into "too wimpy" territory.

Heyo, what Windows laptops are you providing these days? I'm possibly going to jump ship and it's about time to get a new laptop.

Thinkpads are #1. System76 and the XPS 13s are also a hit.

There’s been a half-dozen LVFS / System76 drama threads[1] in the past week alone. Despite whatever your feelings are on BIOS, the general consensuous from S76 owners are the laptops aren’t that great.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17037845

It's a newer thing on our team for sure. Time will tell if System76 are a good choice.

The laptops I see most often mentioned as competitors to the MBP are

Lenovo X1 Carbon

Dell XPS 13 (inc. the developer edition which ships with Linux)

HP Elitebook 840

My advice: for less drama, stick to ones with Intel graphics only. I've seen people have great luck with the Thinkpad T and X series and Dell XPS 13.

I use a Dell XPS 15 with a Dell TB16 dock but I'm not sure I would recommend this configuration to everyone: The machine and dock are very picky about what kernel I run, and I can't get the combo working correctly with suspend/resume on Ubuntu 18.04 (sticking with 17.10+kernel 4.15.18 for now). WiFi also needs to be manually reconnected every hour or so.

People are so hyperbolic about this whole issue. They have one bad generation of keyboards and people declare that they are selling eye candy, aren't a computer company anymore, etc etc.

This was the last good MBP keyboard: https://goo.gl/images/ZDC9hq. The aluminum style keyboard was a big step back functionally. It was obvious it was done purely for aesthetics. And it's just gotten worse.

They are definitely focusing on form over function these days.

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