Comment by guildenstern | Hacker News Reader

Comment by guildenstern | Hacker News Reader

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You’re ignoring my point. Every single day the average person will actively benefit from the direct, quantifiable harm of individuals animals — your lunch, your dinner, there’s probably at least one animal’s suffering associated with it. Every year tens of billions of animals are slaughtered after spending their lives in inhumane conditions.

How many whales are there on earth? How many lions? 50,000 at most. You could put a bullet in the head of every lion on earth tomorrow and it would be a drop in the ocean compared to the hundreds of millions of farm animals that would be killed _on that same day_. And the lions at least wouldn’t have spent their lives packed 10 to a square foot in a barn dying to sickness.

There are some incredible, highly regarded documentaries (planet earth, blue planet) that do far more for educating people about animals than viewing that animal in a cage ever can. If zoos actually created any sort of compassion in visitors for animals then we wouldn’t be having this argument — all they create is fascination in a select few species we’ve deemed to be interesting enough, and what use is that to the animals being tortured on a scale millions of times greater.

Exotic animals are just a tool used to support an entire species cognitive dissonance.

> How many whales are there on earth? How many lions? 50,000 at most. You could put a bullet in the head of every lion on earth tomorrow and it would be a drop in the ocean compared to the hundreds of millions of farm animals that would be killed _on that same day_. And the lions at least wouldn’t have spent their lives packed 10 to a square foot in a barn dying to sickness.

I can't really keep repeatedly refuting generalizations like this. Please re-read the emphasis I've been placing on the sorts of facilities I'm defending.

> There are some incredible, highly regarded documentaries (planet earth, blue planet) that do far more for educating people about animals than viewing that animal in a cage ever can. If zoos actually created any sort of compassion in visitors for animals then we wouldn’t be having this argument — all they create is fascination in a select few species we’ve deemed to be interesting enough, and what use is that to the animals being tortured on a scale millions of times greater.

They've done much more than what you've described. Please re-read my post.

Here's a great start since I'm principally focusing on one facility which can be a model for others, in case you need a particular reference: https://nationalzoo.si.edu/conservation

If you can, I'd encourage you to read it with an open mind.

> Please re-read the emphasis I've been placing on the sorts of facilities I'm defending.

Please reread my comment, I am talking about farms (specifically chicken farms where 10% of chickens will die before they reach 1 month old because they are often packed 50,000 to a barn and not cared for), not zoos. I am not arguing that some zoos don’t do fantastic conservation work, I am arguing that it’s comparatively meaningless when you look at the wholescale abuse of animals perpetrated by the absolute majority of humans on this planet.

> I am arguing that it’s comparatively meaningless when you look at the wholescale abuse of animals perpetrated by the absolute majority of humans on this planet.

At no point was there an assertion that zoos are a cure-all, just that without them, the abuse you're highlighting would be worse, and that there's an opportunity to further heal and reduce those abuses by building and curating more well-maintained zoos.

It seems we've departed from the original premise which drew me to the conversation. I'm not equipped to solve general animal cruelty; I'm only equipped to defend the little corner which zoos seek to aid.

Thank you for the debate. I wish you well.

> ...I am arguing that it’s comparatively meaningless when you look at the wholescale abuse of animals perpetrated by the absolute majority of humans on this planet.

Well, technically, the abuse is perpetrated for the absolute majority of humans on this planet.

My landlord would probably have an issue if I were to pack a few thousand chickens in my spare bedroom yet I like me some chicken nuggets every now and then. And don't even get me started on Whataburger's Buffalo Ranch Chicken Strip Sandwich...pure tasty goodness that is.

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