A Kindergartener’s Best Computer Is About to Die
kickscondor.com
kickscondor.com
Kids are pretty capable and adept at picking up new things. We should be pushing forward with tech literacy while they're still young and not afraid of breaking technology. Touch screens are great because they provided a very directed experience, but I believe that has more to do with the software itself being designed more intuitively when you're limiting the user to app-style software. I think software engineers should be focused on making accessible software for these target demographics. I think getting kids used to keyboard/mice/touchpads will get them more comfortable and prepare them for more complicated things down the line, like coding and word processing where keyboards are objectively a the best input.
For someone with impaired motor control skills I would assume that default software and a touchscreen is far from usable. There is a reason why many touchscreen system has a stylus pen, which would obviously not work in kindergarten for children with impaired motor control skills. A large screen and software designed for it could be one way, but I have also seen massive trackballs that I recall is being used in those situations.
Yes, kids can use a mouse far before Kindergarten. I remember my kids playing PBS Kids games with a mouse when they were probably 3 or 4.
That being said, I do understand the concern if a mouse isn't available as I'm 39 and I can't use track-pads either without grinding my teeth in frustration.
Part of what I'm trying to contest is this elitism of laptop over tablet. My kids can do group activities with a tablet - carry it with them to the carpet, draw things, pass them back and forth, create things with gestures, film each other. The form factor is amazing. And, yeah, then they can learn laptops in third or fourth grade - isn't that feasible?
I'm definitely glad you played Treasure Mountain! when you were a kid. Thankyou for the comment!
Perhaps the issue isn't Chromebooks but that your experience is with inappropriately chosen Chromebooks.
iPad's are consumer devices and will not prepare our kids to be producers. I am surprised every time I see iPad's being used in schools. Chromebooks at least put kids in path of being producers rather than mere consumers of content.
I have quite a few lawyer and doctor friends who use tablets first (usually with a BT keyboard) and only break out the computer when they need it for some very particular reason.
If you don't need root on a beefy machine and/or Windows-specific software, then a modern tablet with a bluetooth keyboard gives you more than enough compute and all the applications you need to be productive. Often with a better UX.
> is more efficient with a keyboard
...?
It’s 2013 thinking to suggest iPads are for content consumption and it’s ridiculous to assert that a Chromebook has any advantage for creation.
And so many people here seem to be forgetting that a bluetooth keyboard is inexpensive and incredibly viable.
Personally, I have privacy issues with Google as well. With Apple, I don’t have a fear that their 3d grade story will end up used to target them for advertising later. I don’t feel comfortable having my kids’ academic life stored on Google servers.
Kids in kindergarten can actually use tablets, to learn other stuff. Any stuff. They can indulge their own interests, in a way that's nearly impossible in any other medium without assistance of someone older than them.
A tablet is the first cut of the way children use the Holodeck in Star Trek. You can't (usually) just ask for what you want, and get it (kids don't have a mental model of computers that works well enough to cope with how bad computers still are at conversation)—but you sure can point at what you want, and get it.
2. Feedback. E.g., there are some good fractions apps that help students understand what it means to "divide" a set of things into a set of groups of things. you can do that on pencil/paper or with other props, but there's no tight feedback loop.
It's unclear whether (2) is strictly a good thing; learning how to validate your own results is also an important skill...
This kind of self-directed, exploratory learning can be very effective.
I was way up there with you right up until I wrote the majority of my upcoming solo hip-hop record in Garageband with Audio Units on my iPad mini, with an AKAI MDP32 as my external MIDI device and an Apogee sound card for insane-quality audio.
Then, due to the amazing workflow, I was able to take those tracks into Logic Pro and refine the hell of out them. Nothing else even comes close to that workflow, as an audio producer of 14+ years.
I make skits, constantly, in iMovie, and even rough drafts of music video ideas on my Mini. Kids can do the same. It's so easy to use.
I wrote the 32-page business plan for my music label almost entirely on Pages with a bluetooth keyboard. Kids can do the same for schoolwork.
I use Pixelmator almost every day to develop high-quality images. The full photoshop is on it's way. There are no such plans for Android.[1]
Kids can even learn rudimentary code with Playgrounds. Not to mention the litany of great educational apps available.
I mean, I could see claiming an Android tablet as a 'non-producer' device, as it certainly lacks software of a quality anywhere close to GarageBand or iMovie, but the iPad?
It's like you haven't even used it, or actually have no use case to use it for creation.
[1]https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-13/adobe-is-...
FWIW iPads and android tablets tend to not work for most software development tasks.The "iPads aren't for producers" mentality might be more of a "iPads aren't for Software producers (and some types of engineers)"
I'm a producer. I produce short film and music, amongst others.
I'm also a developer. I use xCode, Dreamweaver, and Unity to develop applications and games.
Developing - that's what computers are still for. And devs know that.
Developing on-device will come, in time. I, for one, don't have a problem with needing an extra dev machine, specifically for the purpose. I understand this represents a financial burden for some, especially considering the cost of a new MacBook. I'm fortunate enough to have had a Mac by my side since I was 14, and I'm 29 now, which means more than half my life. So for me, already a Mac user, the iOS dev ecosystem was actually a blessing. I understand, however, I am obviously an outlier in that set of data.
I agree; in fact, that was my whole point :)
> Developing on-device will come, in time.
We'll see what Moore and his progenitors think. Until software is the only bottleneck, there will definitely always be lower-tier, cheaper options for the N>50% of the population that doesn't need the compute/batter life/etc. that's necessary for a mobile dev machine. My WAG is that we're still a few generations (as in people generations, not tech generations) from getting there. If we ever get there at all.
It's certainly not for local Windows application development, but it's great for 21st century architectures (infra as code), containerized apps, or any other CI/CD-able scenario.
With an iPad Pro, Apple's Smart Keyboard, and the lovely Working Copy + Textastic, and blink.sh Mosh/SSH client, together with a decent CI/CD (commit code, deploy to dev) pipeline in place, you're good.
See also Buffer, GoCodeEditor, Koder, etc. Several of these happen to be 50% off atm.
Don't forget you can remote desktop to GUI things too, from Citrix to RDP.
This can be anything from "run XAMPP" to "fire up a stack of virtual machines and containers allowing you to mock up an entire data centre all on one physical box."
In contrast, an iPad is little more than an editor and/or terminal that relies on a lot of outside infrastructure to do something meaningful with what you're typing.
> I wrote the 32-page business plan for my music label almost entirely on Pages with a bluetooth keyboard. Kids can do the same for schoolwork.
I would argue that if you need a third party add-on that changes the primary input method you've essentially turned the device into a laptop/chromebook. It's not the right tool for the job, you've just turned it into one.
This was a tired and false talking point five years ago; why is it still being regurgitated as if it were true?
No, they don't produce documents or write code or answer e-mails. But they can't read yet, so I think that's okay for now.
Nowadays I do computer graphics for fun, and I want to be able to create full applications, so I lug around my MacBook, but I have no doubt if I upgraded from my venerable iPad 1 I could find apps that let me play with shaders, or web-apps that let me do quite a bit more.
I agree that there should be a limit (and have practiced this in my classes) but there are some incredible uses of touchscreens that I can't ignore.
I taught English as a foreign language for 5 years at high school level and since I'm a computer programmer by training, my colleagues were very keen for me to introduce technology to the class. I started from that perspective, but gradually reduced the technology until at 5 years I was using a blackboard, paper and pencils only.
For me, (and especially for teaching language, I suspect) it was much more important to keep students engaged and keep their comprehension levels high. I spent a lot of time testing those comprehension levels, modelling responses and encouraging interaction amongst the students. I found that technology moved the focus of the students from the subject to the technology. Instead engaging in the subject, they would become passive and be focused on the device, or presentation. We even had a big wall of dictionaries in the classroom and I asked the students to use it as a resource of last resort. Instead, I wanted them to find people in the room who knew the answer to their question -- teaching language is about communication after all ;-)
From that perspective, it's interesting to hear from someone who seems to take a different approach. I'd love to know what kinds of things you are aiming towards and how the use of technology provides it.
> Just today we did an activity where all the kids 'drew' a visualization of a certain math problem and then we passed the tablets around and added on top off them and then I showed the results on the projector. There was laughter, story-telling, kids helping each other, moving around the classroom, you name it.
I do group activities that involve creating things together that explore the topic. (I look at technology not as a 'subject' but as a 'language' or 'medium'.) So, at home, rather than finding an educational app for them, I would recommend giving them a tablet so they can film the things they experience. Things they see in the backyard or things they make. They can record themselves explaining a topic they learned about. Have them make music (the byte.co Music Maker app is a good one for a child who has no experience with it) and have them mess with vector-drawing or 3-D modeling apps. Then talk to them about what they made and help them get to the next level. The tablet is the 'medium' and you are the 'scaffold'. They need you to find out where to go next.
And, yeah, put the tablets away half the time so they can experience things directly. (Sounds like this is perhaps where your concern lies.)
I've also had great success with Twine once they can read.
Thanks for the great question! I hope this helps. It's really cool that you asked.
I fail to see how this is something that couldn't be accomplished with paper And using the tablets half the time seems like wayy too much imo.
I thought the reason Apple was getting out of the entry-level tablet market, was that it was being commoditized by dirt-cheap Android tablets that—at least for the particular things people want a tablet for—do all the same things an iPad does. (They don't have the same third-party app ecosystem, but if you're just using an iPad to consume content using the web browser/book reader/etc., there's no difference.)
In other words: presuming the educational software isn't already there either way, and still needs to be built—wouldn't Kindergarteners be served just as well by the iPad dying, the development of such software moving to Android, and the kids ending up with a stack of $50 tablets from AliExpress rather than $299 iPads? (Easier for low-income-area schools to get ahold of, too!)
In case you did, and it didn't work as well as the iPad: what makes the iPad the ideal device in kindergarten? Construction quality? Software/Apps?
How good is augmented reality on generic tablets? ..just as one example.
Many people criticizing iPads haven’t used them for education recently or haven’t been trained on how to fully leverage the tech effectively. The curriculum assistance, available (quality) apps and overall device versatily are unmatched by competing devices.
For a media consumption device, iPad could be overkill, but for everything else, it’s almost perfect.
There is nothing on that marketing page that seems to especially improve learning vs. physical materials for anyone under about 10 years old. And frankly most stuff for 10–15 year olds can still (a) probably be done as well if not better using physical materials, and (b) isn’t significantly different between an iPad and a laptop or desktop machine, and often could be done on a machine shared by several students working together or taking turns.
I can well imagine that someone trying to learn how to program might want to use some kind of computer, but even then why an iPad instead of a little turtle robot that responds to Logo, or whatever?
Someone trying to learn how to make electronic music or edit video might get a lot of mileage out of computers (iPad or otherwise) but I can’t imagine this has become a core part of the school pedagogy.
I can also imagine that for anyone in middle school and up there might be a big benefit to carrying an iPad around instead of a giant backpack stuffed with 5 separate overweight textbooks. Though there are some advantages to the physical books too.
* * *
Instead of telling a bunch of skeptical non-teacher techies that we “haven’t been trained on how to fully leverage the tech”, maybe you can explain what that training would entail?
What in your experience has the iPad been so powerful for that couldn’t be done without computers? What age kids are you working with, and what are they working on?
There is a stigma among edtechs (the IT of education) in my area that Android doesn't have the management tools they need - for provisioning software, propagating device settings and such. Presumably that's wrong - (?) - but I also don't know which tablets to recommend, there are too many to try and a teacher can't deal with a flaky device. You have too many students.
Rather than trying to solve that stigma, I am trying to work through the (level 1) discussion of: should we be giving laptops to kindergarteners? (Not talking about anyone here's kindergartener - but those with backgrounds like I see at public school.)
The iPad may not be better - but it works and has less friction to adoption. I'll try to win the battles that I can win. Thanks for the question! I appreciate it.
Also good point about too much choice sometimes being a bad thing.
I started using computers around age 4. I couldn’t read for shit. My parents didn’t withhold technology because I couldn’t read the manual. I’m thankful for that, as now I’m a software engineer and love it.
What insane gatekeeping.
I agree that I'm being a bit hyperbolic - but it's not just that I like the product. It works _very_ well for a specific audience - K-2. Thought it was worth mentioning.
There are also touchscreen laptops - I use a Lenovo Windows 10 touchscreen laptop every day.
Is there some report [anecdotal, peer-reviewed, whatever] comparing kids’ trying to learn using an iPad vs. physical materials? What specific ideas or subjects are effectively learned on the iPad?
Is the iPad being used as a substitute for television? As a way to scale teacher time better when there are many students per teacher? As a tool which a teacher and student will use together? ...
My personal bias would be to generally occupy small children with something tangible (sand toys, climbing equipment, blocks, balls, toy cars, marbles, chalk, scissors and paper, pattern blocks, dice, index cards, yarn, popsicle sticks, pipe cleaners, gears, pulleys, springs, ..., and lots of paper books) until they are a bit older.
If there are many students per teacher and the teacher’s attention is limited, students can often entertain themselves while learning a great deal by working/playing in groups using physical materials.
> Children as young as 24 months can complete items requiring cognitive engagement on a touch screen device, with no verbal instruction and minimal child–administrator interaction. This paves the way for using touch screen technology for language and administrator independent developmental assessment in toddlers.
This sounds like a way of handing a child off to a device so that adults can otherwise ignore them. (Which, to be fair, will unfortunately happen a lot anyway in schools.) And the focus is on “assessment” rather than teaching/learning.
Did you find that there were ideas or subjects that could be taught better on an iPad than using alternative materials (with a teacher standing by to explain in either case)?
I did however talk to an elementary teacher, she said the kids do the reading assignment on a tablet and she has a monitor where she can see at her desk what each individual is struggling with. I'm not sure more about how this works. Lots of enthusiasm from a long time teacher though.
In kindergarten (many decades ago) sometimes we were given individual assignments, such as sticking figures in the right place, coloring things, basic counting... But other times we were forced to interact with our peers and "play together."
As someone who has always struggled to interact with other people, and who had not met any other kids before/except in kindergarten, I think those times were very formative. Hard, but formative.
I still struggle with people as an adult, but I think I would be worse off had I spent that time in front of a screen, whether touch or not, instead of interacting with other kids, including hard times like being excluded from the group with they best toys and stuff like that.
Also, I was using a keyboard (Model M!) as young as 3 years old, and the Microsoft Mouse not much older. I remember watching my dad add the mouse ISA card inside the computer, and learning to use three 5" floppies in the right order: first the DOS one, then the mouse driver one, type MOUSE.COM or something similar, then the Windows 1.0 floppy, and finally I could use Paint or Othello :-)
I think early computers increased my ability for concentration. That's interesting, considering modern devices are said to decrease it.
I will say that one of the things that makes a tablet so great is the potential for group activities. I do a ton of whole-class activities with lots of interaction - and it is possible on a tablet because it is small enough to be easy to look past. This is an issue with desktops (esp. in a lab) and, to some degree, with laptops.
Just today we did an activity where all the kids 'drew' a visualization of a certain math problem and then we passed the tablets around and added on top off them and then I showed the results on the projector. There was laughter, story-telling, kids helping each other, moving around the classroom, you name it.
The fact that you can get up and walk around with a tablet is a point I hadn't mentioned. Thank you for the stimulus!
What was different about their drawings vs. using paper?
I personally use spiral-bound notebooks and erasable pens (friction) as my medium of choice. Yes, with some sort of technological device I could maybe type faster, sort things into lists, make indices, search and replace, have a builtin dictionary, and so on. But would I really be learning more? Or would I just be more distracted in class?
I use technology all the time, including "spaced repetition" apps on my phone, to exercise my memory as much as possible. But I strongly feel the classroom is not the right place for fiddling with that.
If your interactions with other people are done through a screen, then they're very heavily structured and so you don't learn how to actually interact with people in the improvised, real-time way you often have to.
Snapdragon 660, 6000mAH battery, 3GB RAM, 32GB storage. The display is so-so 1920x1200, not the best but still good. And that was $180 from Aliexpress (The iPad Mini is $399)
Especially nothing that would justify the immense cost of an iPad.
Two days ago a mathematician was explaining a concept to me that involved math I’ve long forgotten combined with math I’ve never learned. When I told him I didn’t completely follow, he said “It’s super easy,” and repeated what he had already said - but more slowly.
Now, there were no tears involved, but anyone who is trying to explain or teach something they’re an expert in/at to someone (of any age) who is very much not would do well to remember the three sentences I’ve quoted above. Tears or no, at any age, it’s incredibly frustrating.
Plus, to the extent that touch is a desirable interaction for the target age group, many current Chromebooks are touch devices. (Even the tablet-convertible ones, though are not a convenient size for handheld use by a kindergartner, to be sure.)
the kindergarten for my child doesn't even have TV and nobody has problem, the other branch has one TV which they don't really switch on, can't imagine having tablet in kindergarten, that's just pure laziness
i let my child watch TV like max. one hour a week as reward after trimming nails, of course pretty much zero time with mobile/tablet, it would be minutes per week when watching over my shoulder at some of our photos/videos or rarely gifs i watch
i don't see a reason why should child in kindergarten spend any time in front of screen anywhere, i ruined my eyes by staring at screen, that can't be healthy for children eyes and for many other reasons
i would be curious if they use tablets in other European countries or it's just another example of "superior" american education system