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Comment by jgrahamc | Hacker News Reader

Are you implying that marijuana is "not harmful" and "can improve your quality of life"?

Less harmful than alcohol, without a shadow of a doubt. Zero recorded deaths, in thousands of years of medical use - can :any: other substance say the same?

And yes for many, many people it absolutely improves their quality of life dramatically.

So, I have no idea why you’re taking issue with this statement (unless you work for a pharma co / drug gang, in which case I totally get why you would).

I'm taking issue with that statement because I think the rhetoric around marijuana is misguided. I think it's swung too far to the "there's nothing wrong with marijuana at all" side and that's dangerous. Like alcohol it's important to recognize that it is not harmless. That doesn't mean it should be illegal, just that it should be regulated and reported on accurately.

There is something wrong with it, obviously. But is not deadly and way less dangerous than tobacco or alcohol.

What is obviously wrong with it? If you removed the criminal aspect to obtaining it, then what is wrong?

Zero deaths...ZERO! Not even Potatoes can claim that.

I’ll agree with that, but you should know that’s not how your statement came across, especially the part where you seemed to deny that people could improve their quality of life with it.

If you want people to have reasonable awareness of the potential issues, that’s nice and all - but there will be a pendulum swing from the decades of bullshit from its demonization. If you want to lessen the effects of that, try to be more specific on potential harm without denying the positives.

Yeah, that's fair criticism.

Do you need your coffee in the morning to be able to function properly? is that harmless? What about 3,4,5,10 coffees a day? At some point pretty much anything can grow in an addiction and will hurt you health: pot, vine, coffee, coke, sweets, bagels with cream cheese... nothing is harmless if you overdo it...

So if you are taking issue, what harm are you taking issue with?

My personal experience is that there are people who'll smoke marijuana to the point of not functioning properly in everyday life. It does appear that it is less addictive than alcohol but it's important that people realize that marijuana is not problem free and not a cure all. Which is sometimes the rhetoric from people who pushed for legalization.

People will play video games for days on end and not contribute to society, and could even been seen as "not functioning properly in life"...many people pushed for legalization because there are health benefits (non-addict pain relief, cancer fighting properties, seizure reduction....) - not because it is some cure all.

Ultimately the issues comes down to personal freedom. If you are not allowed to ingest something that does not cause pain or hardship on others...are we truly free?

The thing i've noticed with people like that though, is of they weren't smoking weed to ruin their life, they'd be addicted to video games, or alcoholicss or they get tummy aches, or have so much anxiety they can't go outside or interact with people, or just have some other debilitating addiction or excuse that stops them from getting on with life.

Some people just don't function in life...weed or not.

It might be fixable, just too subtle and deep to fix itself on its own. The mind is vast.

A few will, however: For most folks, it is like being drunk. Sure, you'll drink to the point of not functioning, but that's occasional, on weekends, after work, and so on. It is more likely that you run into people all the freaking time that are doing their jobs while being stoned. They do this pretty happily, and so long as folks are able to do their jobs safely, I don't see an issue. A cashier has no real reason not to be a little stoned at work, for example. This is because of the way tolerance builds with it, and the fact most folks aren't that stoned when they go to work.

I'll add that the only people I've known that had actual trouble quitting pot had other mental issues as well. The other cases are more rare. (Folks often must test this to take work-related drug tests). If someone is going to have an addiction, this is one of the better ones to have (outside of caffeine, perhaps). And we can better research actual methods of helping folks.

It's true that it's often a logical relativism. Some would say whataboutism these days. If alcohol is legal, and weed less harmful thus I can overdo it too :)

We should definitely recognize that marijuana can be harmful along with many other unhealthy and addictive substances wrongly perceived as "harmless", such as Coca-Cola and Hostess cakes. None of those substances should be sold or given to children, for example.

I like this point. Marijuana triggered my first series of psychoses, before which point I enjoyed it while listening to music and hanging out with friends like almost everyone else. Unfortunately, there are too many cases like this to classify weed as "not harmful". I also know of at least two people who almost smoked their life away. They'd be smoking ounces a week, or more, just listening to music, eating and sleeping, with no motivation to do anything else. I believe the one guy is still without a job.

Of course these are anecdotes, but the fact that they are true for myself and people in my life leads me to believe it's probably true for some others, which obviously leads me to the conclusion that it isn't some magical cure-all safety good-time fun drug you can use without consequences. Most people who have a good time with it and are smart about how they use it will praise its benefits to the moon, but I don't know if those kind of people are the majority, they are just very vocal.

You could also say a similar situation could happen with alcohol. Note said , I think in the future , 59-70 years from now healthy people will refrain from alcohol, pot knowing they both have negative consequences to themselves and their offspring

I think society understands alcohol more than we understand weed. We know what the signs of alcohol abuse look like, more or less, and we are increasingly becoming uncomfortable with our peers regularly drinking to the point of drunkenness. It's acceptable occasionally, but even in college I see kind of a trend towards people refraining from that kind of behavior.

It's completely different for pot atm. We don't understand it but still many people think it's perfectly safe and without consequence. Now that it's legalized in Canada we can start to get ourselves informed and observe the real consequences, whatever they may be. Perhaps people will choose to refrain in the future, perhaps people will have a couple joints a week similarly to how seemingly most adults partake in alcohol now.

I also want to make it clear that I don't believe pot or alcohol are without their benefits. Alcohol certainly gives me a tangible benefit when enjoyed in small amounts occasionally. I was only trying to make a point that weed is not consequence free, that we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking it is 100% of the time.

This sh*t known for few thousands of years. Guess what happened to early users. Do you need one more experiment to prove that?

It improves my quality of life. I use it daily to keep my anxiety down. I do not use it during work. I am a productive and happy person! But just like any substance, it can be abused. Thank goodness I do not drink alcohol anymore though. That stuff ruined me. It's a depressant which just made my anxiety and depression worse and almost ended my marriage.

Thanks for this comment. I was thinking of replacing it with alcohol due to legality but this gives me second thoughts...

Although it'd be nice to not need anything, but it helps so much with anxiety (and other stuff).

Alcohol just covers it up temporarily and can ruin your sleep cycle as well. Have you tried exercise? That works for many people as well. Magic Mushrooms are also a very happy illegal substance that really help me.

No, I know it's a sensitive subject, and I'm not even pro cannabis (more CBD friendly). It does still have some medical value for a lot of people (not just immature escapism)

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