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Comment by SuspiciousSwan | Hacker News Reader

I guess looking at movies and books, I could see where you'd get this idea, but it really isn't accurate.

There are different types of feeling good, and the purely chemical good isn't particularly rewarding. There are the moments in life where you are happy because you are living the life you want to live, and those are way better than just feeling good from drugs. Sometimes life goals and drugs come together, and that gets really interesting. It's reasonably common for people to do MDMA and have a glimpse of their life without anxiety and trauma, or LSD and looking at their own existence objectively.

For me, the best moments in my life are around building connections with people.

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Lotta people talking about heroin in this thread, but lets be clear, unless you have tried heroin, or are otherwise intimately familiar with its affects, you are probably not qualified to talk about what it feels like.

Not trying to single out parent, just felt like it should be mentioned.

As someone who's done quite a bit of heroin...All of these comments are sort of correct in their own way. On its own turf, no, nothing will ever feel as good as heroin. Normal life experiences can't compete with that, not directly. But there is a one-dimensionality to its goodness that allows you to have experiences that, though i'm not sure they feel "better" than heroin, feel good in different ways that can be more satisfying, while also being sustainable.

It's sort of like the fact that nothing tastes better than cheesecake (or insert your favorite dessert here), but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy life or even other food without it.

Life would be empty without cheesecake though.

Then I really don't recommend you experiment with heroin :)

I am a very very fat guy trying to eat properly and it’s excruciating, even after 5 weeks away from most of my daily life. Damned if I haven’t toyed briefly and desperately with the idea of some kind of pharmaceutical intervention. But my lifelong policy with drugs has always been if I can’t even handle Mountain Dew Throwback, I won’t have a chance with speed or coke or pot

Unsolicited tip. Something I find has helped me a lot with challenges like you are facing is to stop looking at them as difficult or choices and simply understanding it what you have to and are going to do. Remove the choice from the equation. I had some pretty destructive habits when I was younger and now people comment on my strong mental discipline. This approach has really helped. I recently had to cut all starch from my diet due to an auto-immune diagnosis and went through ketosis. The discipline has now become the habit. It never occurred to me to not follow through even in the deepest keto flu period. It's possible to achieve and once you've beaten one hurdle the next one becomes easier until you control fully your thoughts and not the other way around.

Definitely second this. Choices are hard, but decisions are easy. If you make hard rules for yourself and decide to follow them without exception, it is much easier to stick to, at least, that's what i've found for myself as well.

Much obliged. It’s a surprisingly alien concept for me with food, yet not elsewhere in my life. Odd, come to think of it.

Interesting. I will try to think that way. BTW I’m quite self-disciplined pretty much every other way and I never thought much about it, but I think that’s how I normally am. If it’s not food or caffeine...

Hah, I try to avoid it.

As someone who's been through many different addictions, I'm starting to appreciate freedom from craving (a specific form of inner peace) more than the pleasure of indulging in a craving. (As well as the subtle benefits to mind and mood that come with it!)

Ya. It's sort of hard to explain to people who haven't experienced it, right? They like to ask "does not cheesecake ever taste as good as cheesecake?" and of course the answer is no: Cheesecake always tastes better than not-cheesecake. But there are other dimensions to experience that aren't captured by the immediacy of taste in that sense.

I am not misenjoying your non-shallow depth of double negatives (JK, love your observations)

The dimensionality is the key part. It's not just a metaphor, it's a physical quantity. Like cheesecake, the neurological response to heroin follows a specific profile of activation. However, (most) humans find fulfillment in far more dimensions than any single activity provides.

I was trying to get to this with good versus rewarding, but it's one of those things that is so obvious when you feel it, but hard to communicate with people who haven't.

As far as drugs go though, there is a lot of personal preference involved too. For me, MDMA in unhealthy quantities is still the best that I've ever felt, and I know some other people prefer the meth high, but I don't think that's exactly what you are arguing against :)

I'm writing from personal experience. Well, I've never done heavy opiates in a basement, so maybe going subterranean makes all the difference.

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