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Comment by bradleyjg | Hacker News Reader

> we should just expand immigrant visas on a Canadian/NZ style merit/points system. This would be less discriminatory against people from big countries (China and India specifically), avoid some of the abuse possibilities, and be better for employees/immigrants and their families.

I think a point system is a good way to go, but it isn’t necessary to end the disparate access that those from India, China, the Philippines, and Mexico face. All that would take is a small amendment to section 202 removing the per country caps.

On a separate but related topic, given how large tech employers treat job applicants I don’t believe them when they say the face a shortage of qualified workers. Actions speak louder than words.

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> I don’t believe them when they say the face a shortage of qualified workers.

they face a shortage of qualified, but willingly-accept-low-pay workers.

At least in the big companies, H1Bs get the same offers as American employees. I am not sure about smaller companies. When people complain about H1Bs, I hope they make a distinction between students that actually studied here and then got offers vs the Infosys Wipro type scams.

> At least in the big companies, H1Bs get the same offers as American employees.

This happens in skill sets with high demand and short supply where free agent shopping between a multitude of offers between gigs in the $200+/hour range is viable because supply is so constrained. I guarantee you will not see this uniformly happen in big companies where skill sets are in high demand and even moderate supply, not to speak of high supply. Otherwise, Disney would not be able to use the vendor-supplies-staffing-for-outsourcing-entire-department-contract loophole via HCL and Cognizant, a situation particularly susceptible to that loophole, explaining its popularity among companies big to small.

Of course H1Bs get and accept the same offers. That's exactly the issue.

Don't tell me you never knew the H1B who knowingly accepted a low salary because that was their chance to move to the US, get their food in the door, and hopefully move up. I've known many, from both Asia and Europe, who told me exactly this.

Companies knowingly use this to keep wages lower than the US-based supply would otherwise demand. At one level, I support this -- it maintains a competitive edge.

So what's wrong? Unlike a citizen or permanent resident, H1Bs feel indentured. They are even more risk averse. If you believe in free trade, then the freedom of both parties must be protected. Both H1Bs and undocumented immigrants feel far from protected. There are both moral and economic problems with the arrangement.

A good chunk of low wage h1bs are students. They are desperate to get h1b within the 12-18 months they are allowed to remain in the country. So they will accept any kind of job they can get at very less pay. I know teams that exclusively higher these students instead of bringing someone from India. It's far easier to hire these students and then apply for their h1b than get h1b for someone in India that can easily take 1-2 years. These students are the primary source of all the h1b scams like the ones mentioned in this article. People in India rarely have access to these US scam companies. Also, Indian companies like Infosys hire a huge number of students. Now looks like they have cut down on that, so will see where all these students will end up.

> they face a shortage of qualified, but willingly-accept-low-pay workers.

Even that I don't buy. Even if a company were only looking for people it could lowball it still doesn't make any sense to be so hostile and negligent in how it treats applicants it is purportedly struggling to hire.

I've lived in NYC long enough to have seen renters' markets and landlords' markets. Despite all the claims of a tight hiring market, google, amazon, etc. act like they are in a market where they have the upper hand. And actions speak louder than words.

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