Have you EVER encountered a bad software engineer? Maybe one who managed to over-write something you contributed to a project more than once? Better yet, someone who just annoys the hell out of you? There are probably some who you would never work with for a variety of reasons. Zed Shaw swore off the whole of the Ruby on Rails community. Now imagine that there were bad recruiters too. There are good and bad people in every category and for you to flame everyone in a community because you had a bad experience with one, several or even all of the recruiters you have ever encountered is flat out missing the problem. You should be looking for recruiters who get it just like any savvy person who is willing to hire you for whatever it is that you do right has to look for you. More importantly, you should direct your frustration at the company that hired the recruiter you are frustrated by. When I hire a programmer I do a paired programming session with them and take the time to get to know them and the other way around. Maybe you should spend some time recruiting some recruiters who are with-it by your standards.

Last, but not least, you have to realize that there are some companies that choose to use bad recruiters as a standard business practice. The prefer this. If they do then your recruiter pal isn't the problem.

You should know by now that if a job pays too well then there is a reason. If you are willing to take on jobs that others are most likely passing on then you might want to think about this.

A good recruiter, on the other hand, can create some really good conversations and teams that lead to some really successful companies. A good recruiter is not going to bother asking for references unless there is a reason to, unless they work for a big huge staffing agency and that company requires them to in much the same way that some programming jobs require CMMI. Contrary to britman's comments, recruiters ask for hiring managers because they do serve a role that is SUPERVISORY and that part of their job is to see the team as a big picture. They are often more reliable as a source than a peer. However, peers can be highly reliable too. Think of it as best of 3 - you might not get the truth on the first or even the second try.

Recruiters are a lot like detectives - they have to figure out of you are telling the truth or not, whether you can assess your own capabilities or not, and whether or not you can work well with others. In your case it sounds like the latter might be an issue. A good recruiter might find this post and not ask for a reference from you at all.

To leftnode's point, the "I make more, you make more" line is only true when there is no contract to hire or temp to hire in play. This ONLY applies when someone is doing a fee for placement that is straight up. NOT EVERY RECRUITER WORKS ANY OF THESE WAYS. Some work for the company, some freelance, etc. ASK!!! You are probably not going to get the particulars of how they are getting paid (e.g. the % if it is a fee for placement), but you should reasonably expect that they will tell you that they are getting a % of your hourly or a % of your first year's compensation, or if they are being paid for their time. If they don't want to give this to you then tell them to have a nice day.

If you, or anyone else here, want to talk about this in more detail feel free to email me - hackernewsrecruiter@jobmatchbox.com