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Comment by tvon | Hacker News Reader

> It seems he tried contact and was ignored.

I don't think silence is consent in this case. The whole thing seems like an obviously bad idea to me...

I don't think Martin was trying to ask for permission. It seems to me that he assumed it would be okay to do this, and wanted to let Zed know that his work was appreciated.

I suppose most programmers find it better to ask for forgiveness then for permission.

Whether or not that's true, programmers who go for that approach need to be good at apologizing.

Zed over-reacted. Whatever harm martinemde did to Zed's book is close to nothing. Martinemde took down the derived book as soon as he got the request from Zed, who, while saying "please", also accompanied it with a couple insults.

Part of being good at apologizing is sucking it up and accepting anger from the people you piss off.

Don't go the "better to ask forgiveness" route if you're unwilling to accept some grief.

An equally important part is to refrain from doing it when you think the other part would be gravely offended. As Martin explained, he was paying homage to Zed. Instead of trying to understand the reasons someone would like to homage him, Zed insulted Martin.

When I ask someone to take down a plagiarized version of something I wrote (it happens) I usually point out I do not license the material on my site. I don't call people names not I insult them - I just point out they shouldn't do it and urge them to take the content down because it's not fine with me they reuse it. Even that is rare - I am usually happy with adequate attribution.

I can't understand why someone talented as Zed feels a need to insult people. But that's me and I am not like him.

"An equally important part is to refrain from doing it"

No, that would be closer to the "asking permission" philosophy.

It's better to ask for forgiveness, but asking permission, when feasible and practical (Zed ignored the guy, after all) is nice.

So the steps you really suggest are:

1) Ask permission.

2) If you don't get permission, do it anyway.

3) Complain and berate the people you crossed if you suffer consequences from doing it anyway.

Gah. I think I've had quite enough of talking with you.

Not exactly.

1- ask for permission

2- if you don't get an answer, assume the subject is not that important to the person you asked

3- Do it

4- If person who ignored you denies you permission retroactively, comply

5- Complain when the person who ignored you and then denied you permission to do what you already did, which you promptly removed from public access, also insults you for no reason beyond not getting his attention in the first place.

I think that covers it very thoroughly.

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