Microsoft decides IE 10 has had its fun: Termination set for Jan 2020
theregister.co.uk
theregister.co.uk
I once figured out that IE7 can be tricked into understanding the :before and :after CSS pseudo-elements with this:
.thing {
*zoom: expression( this.runtimeStyle.zoom="1", this.insertBefore( document.createElement("i"), this.firstChild).className="ie-before" );
}
.thing .ie-before {
*zoom: expression(this.runtimeStyle['zoom'] = '1', this.innerHTML = '|');
}Check out Dean Edwards IE7 JS script - this was key to making IE6 behave like a modern browser: https://code.google.com/archive/p/ie7-js/
Edit: better way to view: https://github.com/Integralist/Dean-Edwards--IE-7-and-8-and-...
(But the year is 2019, and we've had fire for thousands of years.)
> We will also publish the IE11 upgrade through Windows Update and Windows Server Update Services (WSUS) for all versions of Windows Server 2012 and Windows Embedded 8 Standard later this year.
Nice! I wonder, will they eventually do this with their Chromium-based version of Edge?
As we also have an analytics on the server side, we extracted a raw log. We used our existing tools that can filter "fake" or "foe" trafic by its behavior. We then manualy analyzed representative filtered samples (still by analyzing its behavior).
It took some time, but was worth it, because we found an opposite conclusion than GA: most of the real traffic ($) from our ie9-10 samples is on ie10.
So now the dev. guideline is: forget ie9 and make it not too ugly/broken on ie10. ;)
PS: We had to do a manual work of filtering because our tools do not filter all the traffic that we know being fake or foe because we often have false positive.
I've looked in depth at the embedded Chromium project, but there's simply TOO much baggage with that making it total overkill when all you want to do is render some HTML in a line-of-business application.
Yes... FEATURE_EMULATION reg key - I know it well ;)
They've already announced that the ability to generate class files in Visual Studio from tlb or dll files is going away.
Extended support for Windows 10 ends on October 14, 2025. Extended support for Windows Server 2016 ends on January 11, 2027.
Presumably one or those 2 dates could be considered the termination date for IE11. My company has chosen the 2025 date as when we will stop support for IE11 in our web pages/apps.
Win7 support is ending Jan 2020 also, at which point IE11 will only be supported on Win10 (and it's not default there). So that may be a good date to start considering ending IE11 support as well, especially with Chromium-Edge coming out later this year.
Just try to run a B2B SaaS without supporting IE11. You will lose out on a ton of large-but-slow-moving customers. Like banks, insurance companies, etc. who all seem to have critical internal systems that only work on IE11 in compatibility mode.
Personally, I'm hoping the app my team builds will be able to finally drop IE11 support once the new Chromium-based Edge app becomes available on Windows 7 and 8.
Goodbye, IE 10. Hopefully IE 11 will soon follow.
IE 11 is still part of Windows 10 and it's in fact the only browser shipping in the long-term support version of Windows 10
Expect IE11 to be around for the duration that Windows 10 is around which, unfortunately, is going to be forever (as Windows 10 is said to be the last version of Windows ever released) or at least for the foreseeable future
Also there’s no guarantee that IE 11 will last forever just because it’s on Windows 10. There can always be a major update in future with it removed if MS really want to kill it..
Is that because "continuous rolling updates" for Windows 10 or because Microsoft will eventually replace the Windows kernel with some other kernel, such as Linux (just a conspiracy theory of mine)?
While consumers have mostly moved on, it will be a long slow crawl away from IE11 for everyone else. Microsoft set this path when they decided not to support this legacy tech' on Edge (and Chrome/Firefox dropped support).
Good. ActiveX and Java Applets are terrible.
There was a huge gap before JS frameworks cought up to Java Applets and Flash after they in practice were dropped.
Unfortunately, my company has decided that as long as MS is providing any level of support for IE, we have to support it. So we will be supporting IE11 until 2025 :-(
If there's a factory controller running some management software that requires Windows and IE, it's not unlikely that it will be cheaper to buy Microsoft, kill off all of its products, and only keep Windows and IE supported indefinitely than retrofitting/upgrading/updating those controllers.
BTW. Speaking of "goddamn long".
If you traveled anywhere by air, it's likely your booking ultimately went through Amadeus [1] which commands 42% of the world's GDS market [2]
They decommissioned their last mainframe in 2017[3]. Yes, mainframe. Because it's oh so easy to "kill something now for the benefit of humanity". But first you have to prove that killing some tech actually will benefit humanity.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amadeus_CRS
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_distribution_system
People shouldn't be building things in web technologies if they aren't willing to keep up with them, which isn't that hard. Unless your web app is poorly designed (i.e. reliant on browser-specific bugs or proprietary features), then an evergreen browser shouldn't be a major concern. If your crap is so mission critical that this is still a concern, then web technologies are entirely the wrong stack to be working in.
And IE10/11 are not that old. When people were developing for them they were current. Just because you've never developed software that needs to be supported for ore than two months, doesn't mean no one does.
> If your crap is so mission critical
If it's mission critical, it's not crap. Crap is stuff that is "not hard to keep up with the web technologies that change every two months".
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/13853/windows-lifec... has these dates currently:
Windows 8.1: January 10, 2023
Windows 7: January 14, 2020
Windows 10 Enterprise 2015: October 14, 2025
Now, if they did backport the Edge-chromium to the earliest versions they'd have the option of pushing that as a browser option but they'd still need a compatibility shim for the many, many Windows apps which use an embedded browser instance to display something.
A 10-year out of date browser just isn't useful, even if it is "secure". And by being the default, they are ensuring that many users are stuck with it. IE prevents me from using a lot of JavaScript and CSS features that have been around for years, all because 40% of my users work for companies or government entities that don't let them install Chrome or Firefox. "Web standards compliance" updates that get rolled out with security updates would solve this problem.
A delightful phrasing that more northern hemisphere journalists would do well to adopt (slightly less constraining or cumbersome than actually specifying a date range, but infinitely preferable to the parochial 'season of year').
[1] https://developer.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-edge/tools/v...
If your clients are still running IE10 on some ancient version of desktop Windows now, they probably still will be on 2020. Heck, one of our clients (a major UK bank) seems to be having trouble getting a few remaining members of their staff off IE8.
And they can't even try dropping IE11 without breaking previous guarantees or changing the path of Windows 10 at least slightly. They locked IE11's support life-cycle to that of Windows 10, and they've stated that Win10 will not be replaced, only updated/upgraded. IE11 is officially here to stay, and even if it wasn't it would be unofficially here to stay if you have clients anything like ours.
All it takes is an old business-critical web app that uses ActiveX controls (or a specific version of Java) to lock thousands of Corporate users into old IE version.
I believe App-V can be leveraged to provide older apps into new OSs, but I'm not sure if IE is supported on that. Failing that, there's always the option of an old Citrix farm, and seamless app provision...
I just checked one of our major internal systems, still a fair number on MSIE7 -- 1 in 66 hits, representing 1 in 34 machines.
Each year we are pen-tested by a third party, each year that client complains that the testers say the SSL setup is potentially insecure, every year we point out that we'd be more than happy to follow the recommendations (in fact we feel dirty not doing!) but it would lock out a number of their users if they were not given an alternate browser or otherwise reconfigured.
Fingers crossed this year is the last time: everyone there should have Chrome as an option, and everyone not depending on old apps (ActivX etc) should have IE11 not IE8. The login screens have had "are you sure you want to use this browser?" messages for IE8 users for a while, but some still use it, though only a few.
This is legacy application. Thankfully for our new applications the contracts state nothing older than IE11 will be supported, and that we only begrudgingly support that so users of IE may experience display issues or other minor usability problems from time-to-time.
Ah yes, the fun of an almost-impossible-to-reliably-detect setting that affects your display and sometimes worse.
have you ever tried document.documentMode?
It is only available client-side though, and while you can feed it back to the server if relevant there (i.e. server-side rendering which most of the legacy code I'm responsible for does) you'd have to keep doing so in case the mode changes between requests.
Also you are forced to add in extra conditionals to your page whether you are working client- or server- side: you can respond to this property to deal with display differences via CSS selectors.