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Comment by shezi | Hacker News Reader

Lots of comments here focus on the fact that this device is WiFi-only and not a "real" cell phone. I find this sad. Are LTE calls really the only use case you can think of for a device that has its source code open, has WiFi and Bluetooth, carries an LCD, a microphone, and a keypad? How boring!

I am really excited about the wiphone, here are some of the ideas I have for it:

* 2FA token generator

* IoT remote

* retro game console

* modern game platform (think pokedex etc)

* educational hacking

And those are just off the top of my head. Essentially, it's a wonderful package for an ESP32 that makes creating useful devices out of that wonderful little processor even simpler.

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None of those have anything to do with a supposed "open source" phone. An open source phone should be able to be a handheld computing device, with cellular and WiFi radios, running a libre OS.

That being said, I do like the fact that it is moddable and the schematics are open. Calling it a phone is a stretch though, it's more like a hobbyist kit.

As others have pointed out, the lines between cell phone, smart phone and phone are getting blurrier today.

There are a lot of devices that fulfill those criteria...

And being honest, I wouldn’t want to use it for any of the reasons you listed. I think this project would be a lot cooler if, you know, it actually worked as a phone.

I've been searching for something like this for a while and have not found anything suitable. Honest question: do you have pointers for any of the other devices you mention?

https://www.dragonbox.de/en/45-pyra is pretty cool

also gp2x https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GP2X (discontinued but you can find them on ebay). Comes in 3 models, GP2x, GP2X Caanoo, and GP2X Wiz.

I had one as a kid and loved it. Got into Linux and programming because of it.

Or a rooted old android phone is pretty similar, more functional than the WiPhone, and probably cheaper as well.

Hmmm, I don't know. If it's not filling the function of a phone, don't market it as one.

> * 2FA token generator

These already exist and are much more secure.

> * IoT remote

No thanks

> * retro game console

No thanks

> * modern game platform (think pokedex etc)

No thanks

> * educational hacking

Ok, I do agree it is interesting from this perspective. I get your overall point, but I still think it's a valid criticism.

You're missing the point, which I agree with shezi is "it's a wonderful package for an ESP32". If you don't want a standalone WiFi phone and can't think of any other useful projects to use it for, then don't buy it, but I most likely will (depending on the cost) because I love this kind of stuff.

You are right. I was being needlessly snarky in response to his proposed use cases.

My main point, though, was that it is reasonable to expect something marketed as a phone to have LTE/cellular capabilities. I don’t think “Show HN: an ESP32 with LCD display — think of all the possibilities!” would hit the front page.

Lots of desktop and mobile SIP clients are sold as phones despite having only ethernet or WiFi. You probably have one on your desk at work. If it can make phone calls, it's a phone.

I think you mean 'cellphone.'

You're right as well :) But I think it's the stuff we did to take it from ESP32+LCD (which there are thousands of) and make it more like a phone are what makes it useful. Not having to build your own power supply and battery charger every time you start a new project is pretty useful. Or a nice enclosure with buttons that work right, feel nice, and are splash proof, etc., etc.

It is technically a phone. Just not one many people would want to replace their smartphones with. Home phone or backup phone maybe. We aren't marketing it as a smartphone replacement. The mobile form factor is useful and not just an evil marketing trick.

in my mind, calling it a "phone" automatically implies a smartphone replacement, so finding out that it's not does feel like a let-down even if that wasn't your intention.

and yes, the form-factor does make this awesome.

how about calling it a wifi-phone?

it would immediately make the limitation clear and avoid disappointment for those like me who are seeking a replacement for their regular phone.

Well, it is called WiPhone...

There is a pretty clear issue with people getting grumpy once they learn it's not a bleeding edge smartphone. I don't know how to solve it. Open to suggestions, but I think calling it a phone is perfectly reasonable and doesn't imply it's a smartphone. Just because all the big phone makers have sold us the idea that LTE and an OS you can play games on is absolutely essential doesn't mean this isn't a phone.

i meant the reference to a phone as in: WiPhone: A professionally-packaged Arduino wifi-phone or in the tag line WiPhone: An Open Source Wifi-Phone That's Really Yours

the definition of a phone for me is a device that i can use make phone-calls 100% of the time and send sms messages. today that implies cell phone (GSM) support. it does not imply a smartphone, especially not a bleeding edge one, nor the ability to play games. (although games on the arduino are actually possible)

btw: i have been traveling without a sim-card before (because i did not have roaming) and the success of finding wifi was more like 20% rather than 80%. rather frustrating.

"it's not filling the function of a phone"

At the very minimum, it matches and surpasses the capabilities of a landline phone (since it works at home where there's WiFi.)

Touché :)

VoIP can be iffy with home ISPs. I have it and the quality varies from excellent to unusably bad. I assume it's due to inconsistent latency.

Do you have QoS enabled on your router?

Not really, landlines work when the power is out. WiFi doesn’t.

If you have POTS and a wired phone. Probably dependent on your location but both are becoming pretty rare.

Thank you. Talking to people about this project often feels like 80% explaining why they don't actually need LTE for this use case, and 15% listening to whining that we haven't released the source code yet :)

I can understand the 15% complaining that you haven't released the source yet - your website very clearly calls this an "open source mobile phone". Something can't be open source if the code hasn't been released yet under an open source license. It might be open source in the future, but it isn't yet, in direct contrast to multiple claims on your website.

You're 100% technically correct, but "WiPhone: A Phone That Will Almost Certainly Release The Code Later As Open Source" doesn't flow quite so well.

It's also not a phone you can buy today, should we put a disclaimer about it not being a real device either?

I think this project looks awesome. I get why you aren't releasing the source code until launch, as I've heard of many interesting Kickstarter projects finding a knockoff on sale before they even ship! So long as you ship it with the source code, you are in good shape. Good luck with the launch!

that's not 100% technically correct. as long as the source is released together with the device the the proper procedure is being followed. if the source is specific to the device, it wouldn't be very useful without the device anyways. (sure parts of the code might be useful, but that's besides the point)

if you want to pay a carrier for always-on connectivity, get a wifi hotspot (i carried one for nearly 2 years). added bonus is that you can connect other devices to it on the go.

as low as $30/month in the states (this is a steal comparatively): https://bestmvno.com/data-only/att-unlimited/

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