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Comment by jancsika | Hacker News Reader

Suppose you buy a Tesla and in 10 months they fold.

Who then maintains the proprietary software that keeps the vehicle running?

"Who then maintains the proprietary software that keeps the vehicle running?"

There are a number of Tesla vehicles out in the wild that for various reasons no longer connect to Tesla and do not receive over-the-air software updates. Some of them are running software versions that are now several years old.

Sure, they don't get the latest software features or UI design, but as a car they still work just fine.

So, pretty much like every other car in the universe that never gets a single update for its decade+ lifespan after it leaves the factory.

ECU and TCU firmware updates are not uncommon.

Recalls can happen a decade later even. Would tesla owners even realize a critical component is defective after the company folds, let alone recieve a recall repair? If I owned a tesla and they folded I’d trade in my car that afternoon.

I would be much more concerned about all the hardware that is pretty much unserviceable by anyone except Tesla.

Would this not be just like any other software that becomes abandon-ware? Use it if you want, but just know there's no recourse if it doesn't work. Also, this would be a good example of why right-to-repair should be allowed.

If Tesla stock is at lower multiples it would become an interesting take-over target so I wouldn't worry about this

This is a good question whether Tesla survives or not. If you buy a car that is heavily dependent on software, even if the brand does not go out of business, who will support it in 10 or 20 years? Most automakers do not support their vintage cars or make new parts for them.

A 20 year old car today is heavily dependent on software, and they still seem to work.

Are they though? The software in 20 year old cars is more akin to that in a digital wristwatch (as in, super basic and never needs updating). Also, old cars contain far more electro-mechanical components than software. In comparison, modern cars are Internet-connected computers on wheels (especially Teslas).

For example, my 1999 VW has a mechanical headlight switch, dead simple mechanical starter engagement, manually-controlled climate controls (there's a direct physical connection between the dials and the flaps), electro-mechanical wiper control relay module, a basic self-contained radio, manual windows, and directly switched interior lights. Heck, the only thing that is computer-controlled is the engine timing, fuel injection, turbo actuator, dashboard dials, ABS, accelerator pedal/cruise control, airbags, and locks. And my car is hardly out of the ordinary.

Software doesn’t just fail, though. If it works today, it’ll work tomorrow.

You could lose features that depend on connectivity, but you’ll still be able to drive.

Doesn't the 3 model require a phone to unlock, and if you want a separate fob, you need to pay extra? What happens when the phone app is no longer available? I don't like that it doesn't even have a mechanical key.

It comes with key cards and you can program additional key cards in the car.

A 20 year old car isn’t really vintage, but it’s trivial to find parts for most cars going back at to the 90s, at both the dealership and places like Napa.

I guess whoever buys up that aspect of Tesla when the shareholders sell it to pay them and the company's debts off.

If someone does it I would imagine they would charge for it. Considering Tesla is considered a luxury brand there would probably be a decent business there.

Are there historical examples of this happening in other companies? It's scary to think the answer to ops question is not immediately obvious.

This seems to be similar to any of the digital media companies that used DRM on all of their content that suddenly could not be played when they shut down the service.

This sort of happened to Saab, but since they were basically badge-engineered GM cars at that time it is still easy to get parts.

When Daewoo left the US market 20 years ago they pretty much just upped and left.

Delorean folded but iirc maintained their oem market

There are many auto manufacturers that have left various markets or folded at various points in time. Most major recent one I can think of off the top of my head that isn't mentioned in another comment is Suzuki leaving the North American market in 2012 (USA) / 2014 (Canada).

In the unlikely event that Tesla goes bankrupt, that actually keeps the company going while it sorts out its debts.

I'm curious whether Tesla mortgages are sufficiently concentrated that there are specific instruments that collateralize large portions of them, and you could buy credit default swaps on those.

I mean, if the value of the underlying asset is suddenly reduced, you'd expect delinquencies to rise markedly.

Hopefully they can open source it and start and organisation like Mozilla. Others could use the software to make their own "Tesla" too.

Most likely some other company would buy anything valuable before it could be given away for free.

What kind of car are you driving??? My Acura 2016 doesn’t support AppleCar and never will. I don’t think there are any other cars out there that get updates anyways!

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