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Comment by Cshelton | Hacker News Reader

Providing internet is not the only reason SpaceX's StarLink [0] is a project ;p

Yes, GNSS spoofing is an industry wide vulnerability, and not to just cars. If I'm not mistaken, at least in the U.S., it is highly illegal?

[0](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starlink_(satellite_constellat...)

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Most things that can be described as "shenanigans over RF" are illegal, but they're difficult to trace. Sure, if you broadcast from your house 24/7, the FCC will eventually send their direction-finding vans to look for you. But actual attacks can be localized, low power, and short duration.

It's come to my mind that someone could easily cause a small panic transmitting a fake EAS broadcast about some disaster or attack over FM stations duting heavy traffic in a city. Never heard of anyone doing it though. In high school I did play a fake alert from youtube about incoming nukes through the aux-in of a portable radio and had someone believing it for a minute.

Next you will be shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theatre!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shouting_fire_in_a_crowded_the...

Reminds me of The War of the Worlds:

> The program has become famous for supposedly tricking some of its listeners into believing that a Martian invasion was actually taking place.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_War_of_the_Worlds_(radio_d...

IIRC, most radio stations get their EMS broadcasts by listening to another station. So if you can spoof the right one…

Good example of this is the 4 watt limit for CB radio transmission. I remember being a kid interested in ham and CB radio as a kid and being blown away seeing someone's "illegal" 300W amplifier.really doubtful that the FCC opens many investigations over that.

Another example is PMR, aka. walkie talkies. In many countries, you can use the PMR frequencies unlicensed only through radios with non-removable antennas limited to 0.5W of TX power. Doesn't stop people without licenses from buying and using handheld transceivers intended for HAMs and professionals (like the popular UV-5R with 5W of TX power and a removable antenna) on these frequencies.

CB Channel 6 is still an ongoing cultural phenomemon. Now that it's the summer, it's back alive with 10kW transmitters all over the place. Today not a single channel was empty, and there was a lot of lower sideband, and freeband operations going on above CH40.

I know a guy in my neighborhood who has a old beat up GMC suburban, with a CB radio, a 5kW "12 pill" amplifier, 3 alternators, and 2 heavy-duty CB antennas installed, and he goes by #1 on the air. Guys like him still participate in CB radio shootouts like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyAqzFXDMys

All the while the FCC doesn't bat an eye. This is because they typically don't cause that much harmful interference. Even though the transmitters are often overdriven and non-linear, typical spurious emissions are outside of critical communications bands and aren't the source of many RFI complaints which drive a majority of FCC investigations.

GPS jammers are frequently used by drivers of GPS-tracked assets to help fudge their numbers. Such devices are very readily available online. However, their goose is cooked the moment they drive past an airport or military base. The airport quickly goes into ILS-only approaches, and local RF direction-finding agents are put into action. I'm surprised it doesn't occur more often than this - https://www.nextgov.com/defense/whats-brewin/2013/08/every-t...

You can also spoof aircraft instrument landing systems with relatively cheap SDR's

https://aanjhan.com/assets/ils_usenix2019.pdf

> Providing internet is not the only reason SpaceX's StarLink [0] is a project ;p

Is there any indication that they intend to use it for vehicle location / navigation? I see nothing in your link about that.

> Yes, GNSS spoofing is an industry wide vulnerability, and not to just cars. If I'm not mistaken, at least in the U.S., it is highly illegal?

Whew, for a second I was worried. At least we know we're safe since terrorists never break the law!

Correct. Terrorist have and always will attempt to bring fear/harm/death to people in many different ways.

This is not an autonomous vehicle problem..., it is a human nature problem.

And no, I can't speak to all of StarLinks' use cases.

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