Software made me loathe my car
mikkel.hoegh.org
mikkel.hoegh.org
Renting a car with CarPlay for a week (and a reasonably long "commute" during that time) completely changed my mind. Typically the only reason I ever used a built in car display up to this point was...to set up my phone in Bluetooth. Suddenly I had familiar applications that made that screen useful: Maps, Overcast (podcasts), Messages (read aloud, not displayed, of course), etc. A phone in a holder is, of course, totally acceptable and fine, but as I'm just starting to consider buying my first car in almost a decade I'm suddenly looking at CarPlay as a requirement.
Other notes on this for those that are interested: A lot of cars with CarPlay also support Android Auto, and they always have a base system if you'd prefer not to use either. OP is talking about this from a luxury car perspective, but it's available in a really wide price range from entry to super-luxury.
I'd much prefer that display be an extension of my personal device. I don't want a new infotainment ecosystem with the manufacturer's choices baked in, I want the an extension of the one I'm going to keep using when I get out of the car, replete with my personal preferences for things like map applications, music, etc.
Does your wife's have an issue where once in a while it refuses to go into AA, and you have to hard-reboot the infotainment system? Mine does this thing where AA icon shows up, touching it does does the click animation, but doesn't actually launch AA.
That's my only real complaint with the system, actually. Once in a while it just really doesn't want to launch AA. Once I'm in though... works great. (Okay, maybe the steering wheel could use a play/pause button, but that's minor)
Perhaps it was my coming from the crime against humanity that is CarWings in my old Nissan Leaf. I liked my Leaf, but there was nothing on the center console that wasn't better on my iPhone.
https://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/10/2015/11/2015-ford...
the newer fusions replaced controls with actual buttons which looks cheaper and doesn't make it any easier to figure out without looking. probably due to increased failures or simply cost savings
With your phone you know not to touch it when driving but the center console feels acceptable.
I had one close call where the car's auto breaking saved me from hitting a car that decided to turn without indicating. now I treat my centre console almost like my phone, I will use the console stopped at lights but not my phone.
i use voice control and steering wheel buttons only whilst driving, works well enough!
To be clear, I hardly touch the infotainment screen while in motion. I can do almost everything I need to by voice, the only touch command is to choose an option from a list.
It would be nice to have a HUD projected on the windshield, but I don't find it distracting to look at the Infotainment screen.
no one will follow this advice, but no one will think they will be in an accident until they have a huge welt on their head and can't figure out why.
I guess?
What do I do about the legally mandated 2-4lbs steel backed rear-view mirror that's required to be hand-removable without the use of tools in most places?
To be clear, i'm not saying you're wrong -- i'm saying that making a car a safe crash space will drive a person mad. It's practically impossible.
It might bounce but at that point there's way less energy involved and the accident's intense enough that a welt on my head is the least of my problems.
I came to a compromise of using ~1/4" aluminum rods anchored in the forward vent and around inside the CD player to create a phone holder cradled above and slightly off to the right of the main dashboard. This creates a mechanically sturdy enclosure that I really wish cars would come with built in.
A HUD would be even better but I don't think I could ever trust a display driven by car manufacturers' software stacks.
[1] Apple gives the car manufacturer the ability to truncate the length of scrollable lists while the car is in motion, which Mazda does. Nothing like only being able to see the first 15 items in a list of podcasts, or artists, or songs. I hate this. But otherwise the implementation is great, especially the integration between the car's physical controls and CarPlay. There's a steering wheel button to bring up Siri. There's direct physical button access to Maps, Now Playing, and the home screen. It would be nice if Apple allowed me to set Google Maps as the default mapping app, but Apple maps has become good enough most of the time. Aside, my 2016 CX-9 came w/o CarPlay. Mazda made it available as a DIY'able retrofit last year. The parts were a couple hundred dollars and it took a couple hours to retrofit.
[2] Once the entire entertainment system froze up and it didn't fix itself till like the next day. I've been meaning to check if there's an update from Chevy.
“Give me directions to foo using Waze” - gives directions to do using Waze
This might be new, but it definitely works on the iOS 13 beta, although I’m pretty sure it worked on iOS 12. It would still be nicer if we could just set default apps
1. "Intelligently filter content when the vehicle is moving. Certain cars may cause CarPlay to truncate lists of content when the vehicle is in motion or has exceeded a certain speed."
2. contentLimitsEnforced: A Boolean value indicating whether contents limits are enforced by the content server.
3. enforcedContentItemsCount: Returns the number of content items that are displayed when content limiting is enforced.
[1] https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guideline...
[2] https://developer.apple.com/documentation/mediaplayer/mpplay...
[3] https://developer.apple.com/documentation/mediaplayer/mpplay...
And that's one thing I have noticed, Android pretty much owns the industrial market. Every touchscreen device you see in the wild is basically an Android device. Those payment kiosk things in restaurants, CarPlay, etc.
AFAIC, Android is best suited as an industrial OS. Before android it was Windows CE, which was even bigger garbage than Android, and of course now it is dead.
Alternatives are things like custom rolled Linux (and really why?) and RTOS/GUI platforms like vxworks, qnx.. they have their place. 90% of shit can just use stock android and whatever mods you need.
It does make sense, it's pretty customizable and a lot of the legwork is done for you.
Subjectively, running Android 10 on a Pixel 2, battery life has never been better, and apps running in the background sucking up my battery hasn't been a problem.
I've used the ubiquitous cheap Huawei and Xiaomi phones, and while they get the job done, the experience isn't nearly as good, as you have to deal with their UI and clutter. Unfortunate.
I have a Honda Civic and it's definitely an Android tablet shoved into the dash.
I was wondering which manufacturer was going QNX instead.
[0] the update instructions say to put the update file on a FAT32-formatted USB drive and plug in. The update file is 6GB and FAT32 has a 4 GB file size limit. Tried exFAT, UFS, and a few other file systems QNX has support for, no go with those.
Give that a try on any car you look at, you may find it works.
The need for internet access is slightly irritating however.
I’ve yet to have it work a single time, and have just given up, after (in your own words) shouting at the car.
1. That I can't tell siri to play things on spotify, etc, although apparently siri support for spotify is coming. I'm on the iOS 13.1 beta but it's still not there
2. Carplay limits the listing of bands/albums/songs in the menu. I get that they don't want me visually scrolling through hundreds of albums while I'm driving, but since there's no carplay search, and I can't (yet) control spotify with siri, this means to play the music I want I have to pick up my phone and select my music from there. Much less safe than if they just listed all my music on the screen.
They list far more albums when the car is at a stop, but it's still not all of it. Scrolling through my artists gets me to about G before it stops listing.
Siri support for spotify really can't come soon enough for me.
I think the wording may some "certain cars" enforce it because after-market head units may not be connected up to the speedometer and therefore have no way of including this information.
I have no idea how they’ve managed to design it like this, it’s like they only think single driver commuters would use it
That's releasing early next month. Probably a gold master build at the event on 9/10, with wide release following after that.
I'm also not a fan of Siri, would love to keep it disabled as I normally do, but CarPlay doesn't even start without it :/
On further reflection, I think it's still overall not a good idea. If the driver wants to change the music being played, or the volume, or whatever, and there is a passenger in the car with them, then I would think it would be okay for the driver to have the passenger do that on their behalf. And that might affect the display.
But I guess I can wait to see if iOS 13 can change my mind.
Best solution I've found so far was putting my Spotify account on my drivers phone, then I can change the music using my phone without messing up waze.
And after that she becomes annoyed she can't play Pokemon go or whatever game anymore :p
You may not agree with the design choice, but it’s completely obvious why they made it that way.
The case where then passenger needs to do something is rare enough when compared to the safety issues. In design you also need to weigh and make trade offs.
The normal car bluetooth systems on the other hand don't mind if you don't give them access to things, and you can restrict it to music and calls only.
And, in Australia, it's very easy to lose mobile reception. Having usable maps on device is a must.
I still get an occasional dropout where the song gets really quiet for a few seconds but my Spotify app keeps running and no longer switches to Amazon Music randomly.
There was one that could spoof an iPad and allow it to be used as the CarPlay display and interface from the iPhone.
Aren’t these screens almost entirely bad? In 10 years, screens in cars will be the new smoking, except that they kill other people, and the NYT will be full of editorials about how they snuck up on society and caused so many accidents - who could have known?
Why don't you loose your requirement to just 2DIN space to install your favourite Car Play compatible gadget into?
For android DIY folks , another route is to build your own open source AndroidAuto receiver with e.g. http://headunit.viktorgino.me/ + https://thepihut.com/products/raspberry-pi-official-7-touchs...
What I'd be willing to compromise on is an external screen that will handle CarPlay or Android Auto. I can't seem to find one out there.
Maybe not the authoritative source but interacting with a phone while driving is indeed illegal in all of Europe.
You presumably meant EU, a part but not all of Europe, but that too is wrong. For example, the law in the Czech Republic, a member state of EU, states that it forbidden to hold a phone (or other handheld device), in hand or otherwise (e.g. between shoulder and ear) while driving (§ 125c / 1f) 1. z. č. 361/2000 Sb.).
Handheld devices probably are illegal to use while driving in all of EU while being (hand)held, but absolutely not when mounted and used in the same manner as car’s builtin display. It may be the case in some country, but is not true generally.
It’s a requirement from now on! :)
I keep saying that an EV with carplay has made me look at a car differently - it’s a chassis with a battery. Choose the size of both according to what fits, say, 99.9% of all trips. For someone who lives in a city and have a charger in the garage of course this is a luxury, but to me it just makes so much sense.
Car companies are NOT in the business of building infotainment systems. They are in the business of building cars. A while back, to compete and differentiate themselves, they all started to build their own touch screen systems with their own custom interfaces. All of them sucked. Even the ones that were the best of their class still sucked. Not only that, every single interface was different. Going from car-to-car meant re-learning a new system. They all have limited resources to throw at this problem so everything is sub-par. It's like going to McDonalds for good coffee -- no, you go to a coffee shop if you want good coffee. McDonalds just provides coffee because they have to. Same is true for car manufacturers.
Trusting the OEM is just a bad idea. It is better for everyone involved to give this responsibility to those who are good at it. Apple and Google both have huge ecosystems of accessories and application developers -- not to mention massive user bases. Apple and Google have entire teams dedicated to integrating with auto makers and ensuring that the experience is consistent across all vehicles.
So why would you want to pay thousands of dollars more to get, for example, a navigation experience on your car that sucks balls? Instead you can plug in your smartphone – which some have arguably more computing power than a lot of commodity PC's sold in the last few years – and have a vastly superior experience.
I'd love to buy a luxury car that lets me hook up my iPad for all infotainment and GPS. Just give me a nice simple dock that looks good with the rest of the fit and finish.
I've dreamed about being able to dock my phone in place of that shitty GPS.
get one before tariffs kick in. you're welcome.
I'm in Phoenix, Arizona - and even in the middle of summer, with the sun beating down and turning the inside of every vehicle into an impromptu slow cooker (seriously - you can slow-cook in your car here in Arizona; that is, if you don't mind your car smelling like a working kitchen afterward), the LCD never had any problems that I could see.
I was honestly very surprised, as LCDs are normally very temperature sensitive (more to cold than to heat - but I would think that the temperatures inside a car in the summertime would be hot enough to cause problems). Usually, though, whatever the temperature - if the LCD has problems, once it comes back within it's normal range it will start working properly again.
Alternatively, the more bloat they cram into the machines, the more they can charge.
I’d love a car that was just a car, a set of speakers, and A/C.
My 2004 TJ is pretty much that - it's dash is reminiscent of the basic dash I had in my old 94 Ranger.
In an original Wrangler (ie - pre-JK, 2 door), the dash is pretty "small" - there isn't a lot of room between its front and the firewall - so while it seems like a lot is crammed in there, it also makes fishing wires and such fairly easy (coupled with the bareness of the interior - custom wiring is a dream - just lay it down and zip-tie it to the rollbar in most cases).
The "center console" area is almost designed to be modded, and plenty of people have done it. But if you want to keep it stock, it is pretty bare-bones. You can even get it with a cigarette lighter -and- a DC power outlet (I should also note that one mod that I've seen was kinda neat - stowing a small inverter behind the passenger speaker area with the "plug" mounted nearby on the side or underneath the dash area).
The downside is that it isn't a new vehicle - but I have the "bulletproof" 4.0 I6 - so even with it's mileage, I'm not worried. There's also the fact that the interior is...spartan (and the body isn't designed to protect you in an accident - not a big deal, as usually most cars that get into accidents with Wranglers disintegrate, while the Wrangler is usually drivable - might have to take a hammer to some parts first). Despite it being basic, though, the AC works incredibly well here in Phoenix!
Oh - and terrible gas mileage - there's that - though having a lift, 33" ATs, and a rear tire carrier don't help either (I've heard that you can get up to 16 mpg with a TJ on stock tires and no lift - but I ain't changing mine - I'm fine with 12 mpg - smiles per gallon, man).
But...but...if you can live with all that...you too can own a wallet that cries itself to sleep every night.
For the record I also use my driving time solely for the purpose of driving. CarPlay doesn’t have to mean annoying interruptions.
Tesla's system might be good right now, but they're unstable fiscally as a company and they have NO incentive to be excellent in designing software and maintaining old software far into the future. And Tesla might go belly-up, at which point their ability to maintain said software declines to zero.
Look at that sales trend line. Rocket ship. They aren’t going belly up any time soon.
I have a Mazda 3 skyactiv which is not a luxury car. The infotainment system is rather very solid. It's very responsive. I almost never had a problem with Bluetooth and I never needed to use the touch screen because the buttons UX is good enough.
Comparing to the other crap I've seen in the same category cars, I'd say the Japanese pulled a hell of a job.
A friend of mine had an early-2000s Mercedes S-class. It was a very expensive car when it was new and still an amazing car in almost all respects -- except for the completely outdated, ugly DVD-based navigation system. He used a dashboard mount for his smartphone instead.
Even luxury cars made less than 10 years ago have screen software that feels very outdated compared to what a new Honda Civic comes with. The cars still drive great, but a significant part of the way you interact with them is obsolete.
I hope both Carplay and Android Auto continue to get regular updates and don't break backward compatibility, so a car that comes with one of those systems today won't feel obsolete in 5 years.
It's not unreasonable to expect a fridge or TV to last 10 or 15 years. Yet, if it's "smart", and had a top-of-the-line processor put in it 10 years ago, today it would be equivalent to running an iPhone 3G. More likely, it was in development for a couple years, and was based on a cheaper/lower-end/older processor.
Cars have the same problem, but with the non-tech part being 5 digits $$$ instead of 3 or 4.
I think part of the problem is the manufacturers would rather you replace the entire thing (because the processor is outdated). Someone buying a new fridge every 3 years (instead of every 10-15) because theirs won't run the latest apps is great for them.
With cars, Android Auto and CarPlay have so far saved consumers from that nightmare.
I don't know if these systems are outsourced or built in house by the airlines, but they make my blood boil every time. Especially considering that airlines pay the plane 100+ M$ but they save money on putting crappy Android tablets with a bloated software on it...
Do you want to know how you can tell if someone can actually afford a luxury car? Its not whether they get good financing, or whether they get options, its whether or not its serviced.
>but I’m equally sure I’d be charged some outrageous fee for that “service”.
You see, actual luxury vehicle owners do not question the price at all. They dont see anything other than the signature box on the invoice. You could for example as I have, charge $190 just to replace the light in the glovebox, and they wouldnt think twice about that amount of money. I was once faced with a BMW owner looking at seven thousand dollars to replace their electronic air-ride suspension, and the hardest decision they had to make was whether they should buy another BMW while this one was being serviced.
Luxury owners rarely see opulence as anything more than a disposable commodity. If they dont like the apps, or if they dont like the stereo, they just buy a different car. A salesman once told me of a woman who traded her 8 month old Porsche in for a BMW because she didnt like the little song the car played when it started up.
I often wonder about the people who drive late model luxury cars, on the rare occasions I see them in my town. Are they killing it? Or did they buy it on finance to compete with the Jonses?
Or it's a tax deduction because leasing cars are deductible while buying them is not as easily deductible, so it's overall cheaper for them to act that way then to be traditionally money smart about it.
Compare the fusion to an A4 and you’ll find the A4 feels cheaper. Now an A6 does not compare to a fusion, but a Lincoln continental blows it away.
It’s all in the eye of the beholder (luxury by name, or actual feel of luxury). If anything a Volkswagen competes with Honda these days. Utilitarian and bland... plus Volkswagen will have a random electrical failure that totals the car. Now if you had said Nissan you would have had a point (but the price point doesn’t match Ford)
The last Ford I owned was about 16 years ago so I don't know what they're like these days. Swapped it for a Honda Jazz/Fit and more recently I have a Golf. The build quality of the VW was a big step up from the Honda. Simply felt more solid and sturdy. Both have been reliable.
Last two demos I've bought (both German) were both priced around the same as an equivalently specced brand new Japanese model.
"Actual luxury vehicle owners" are just the mass affluent. There's really nothing special about them. The upper 20% household income demographics of just about any developed nation. Read the sales numbers for literally any of the German big-three. They're just what you expect. A4s sell more than any other Audi sedan; Q5s sell more than any other Audi SUV.
The typical owner isn't someone with a 7-series.
Makes for a nice story, though. And sure, the mass affluent frequently lease. They also often live beyond or max out their means.
I used to sell computers at retail. Probably 5% of customers were mega-rich. One guy dropped $50k on laptops and accessories for his kids for Christmas. Another lady paid me about $5k to run some Ethernet cable, build a fancy desk and setup her workspace.
Your entry level rich person is a surgeon. The Ethernet lady owned a half dozen McDonalds.
Every car company should provide some basics, like bluetooth connectivity, but aside from that, Android Auto and Apple Carplay are the ways to go. They get updated constantly and are made by companies with stakes in keeping them current. This way, I don't need to purchase a new car to get decent software.
That said, there have been regressions in UI usability and some things that should have gotten attention haven't, such as USB audio.
I should mention USB audio is interesting because it allows you to play uncompressed music in FLAC and Apple Lossless directly (bluetooth does not)
> the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration announced that it would require all automobiles sold in the United States built beginning in May 2018 to include backup cameras
Just make sure there's an 1/8" jack, too, so I don't have to deal with Bluetooth.
or wait, is this just what getting old is like? Do the kids these days think everything works great?
I feel like I'm not in control of most of the technology in my life, and most of it is unreliable and unpredictable and has terrible UX.
What I’ve noticed is there are still industries that don’t use a lot of computers yet and every once in a while the entire industry all at once decides “we need to force computers on everyone now”. And they do this way ahead of putting any thought into user experience so it usually sucks and you end up dealing with new sources of shitty computer interfaces sometimes I.e. smart TVs. But they do generally seem to get gradually better from there.
Phone keeps getting jankier and jankier UX as the software gets more and more and bloated (I'm looking at your Chromium and Google Maps). Right now my virtual key presses lag about 5-10s
Pretty much any single technical device or software component in my life malfunctions in several ways. Just last night I rebooted UE4 Editor about half a dozen times when it started rendering black and mouse stopped working. I have a Cardo bluetooth set (for motorcyclists) and every feature in that device is broken/malfunctioning in some way. And I paid 200€ for that. Utter f*n BS.
Steve Jobs greatest contribution was to scream at people to make their shit work. I wish every engineer had a personal stevejobs screaming at him with a red face to make his/her shit work.
Unfortunately the sad fact is.. there's no value in quality to businesses. As long as people buy their shit (and there are no better quality competitors) the added quality would only be an added cost.
That said I'm pleased to drive a car with no in car computer.
I miss the days when software would ship when it was done. Or as close to done as reasonable. Living in the days of constant updates means I don't know what my phone's UI is going to look like tomorrow.
Hopefully we can find a balance in the coming years.
When I was a kid in the 80s every adult I heard complained that they couldn't set the clock on their VCR, but that every 12 year old knew how instinctively.
The recent story about how Cisco routers would 'phone home' to see if your license for the software was still current and not operate if it wasn't struck me as another absurd example of how lame this can be.
What always astonishes me is that a company like BMW which makes an excellent car can convince itself that it can maintain and operate a software service infrastructure. Just get a few web designers and some coders to whip up an app. Reality is complicated, and what others make look "easy" (Amazon, Google, Azure) has a lot of layers you can't easily "outsource."
Even back in the 90's Sun was fretting over the fact that if you just bought one copy of Solaris with your computer and never upgraded, all those engineers sitting around would just consume cash waiting to do something. Free software has whacked the software business model even further afield.
I continue to use it because Sirius XM horrific sound quality is always there, whereas Bluetooth occasional does what it's supposed to.
The BMW Connected app provides more frustration than value. I use it on occasion, when I've forgotten about how terrible it is.
I loathe voice control systems of all kinds, doesn't matter how good they are. I hate both talking to computers and listening to computers "talk". The first thing I do when I get in a new car is turn off the voice.
You can get map updates much cheaper from people hanging out in BMW user Internet forums who sell them for $50. If you're a computer person and can follow instructions you can save a lot of money on map updates.
It works wonders for me (similar model to B018WV3F50 on Amazon).
It just seems like a huge waste of time, effort, and money for something that a smartphone can do, all while introducing a mandatory version of a potentially fatal distraction. And it looks shitty and operates pretty terribly.
Maybe this will make more sense if/when cars become fully automated, but it should have no place in a vehicle today, when your attention should be on the road.
Meanwhile my wife's car has a full infotainment system and I have to stare at it to figure out what buttons to hit next and it drives me nuts.
That said I'm also partial to removing all screens outside of some kind of GPS. People already don't respect driving their 2-3 ton machine at 100+ feet per second, stop giving them even more reasons to not pay attention to the road.
Most dump trucks don't have infotainment modules. Some are lucky to even have seats.
I wonder how many collisions/deaths are caused directly by drivers needing to look down at their “infotainment” to do anything at all.
I think this is acceptable if it's kept to a small screen, or integrated into the rear-view mirror. But, I dont think this should give manufacturers an excuse to add an entire, shitty infotainment system.
My opinion of course, but I have to wonder how many accidents are caused by people staring at their integrated screen of potential death.
Just because your center console _can_ play a film, or show that sportsball game you want to watch, doesn't mean a responsible driver will use it for that. Blaming the screens for irresponsible drivers is probably blaming the wrong thing entirely.
I often use company cars and they are always nice and comfortable, but I didn't encounter any software system I like yet.
I my car I rig my smartphone to the audio and have all features with slightly worse ergonomics.
Maybe interesting for families that often drive on trips but I don't really see the added value yet.
But, it would actually be interesting to get more technical information about the car. But these are hidden by the shitty proprietary software in cases I encountered. And of course you don't get access to maintenance information without manufacturer specific devices...
It was expected that manufacturers try to roll their own systems and try to hide actually useful info in favor of some fucking internet music store. Disappointing.
I also know that whatever car I go to, no matter how crappy the entertainment system is I get to use CarPlay and don’t have to worry about the OEM garbage. Slow? Ugly? Confusing? Who cares!
I’ve outsourced the entertainment system to a software company with a clue, and I couldn’t be happier.
My maps are real-time updated by Apple. I can listen to whatever new streaming app comes out next year and takes over the market. I have Siri for voice commands, not the awful thing built into my car.
Sorry car makers, you screwed up for too long. Now everyone just wants to bypass you with CarPlay (or Android Auto).
They literally added extra systems to disable it so they could charge rents.
The market will decide.
In my opinion, the sane way to approach cars is to accept that it's an excellent mechanical machine with shit software. Even if they were to do an awesome job, which they won't, over the years the software/screen will get outdated.
The solution is to minimize the software use, and enjoy the car as a mechanical machine, eg. buy the torque-y 30d not the 20d. Eg. I know the map is shit, so I just don't think about it, I have a $2 thing and I mount my phone and that's it. My phone will always have a nicer screen, better software, better 4G, it will always be configured better for me (I get a new phone every year).
On the car, I just use the radio, the bluetooth for Spotify (sometimes it doesn't work), and that's it. Things like "CarPlay" or whatever, voice commands, it's better not to think about it and just enjoy the ride.
The only tech upgrade I'd take on a new car is the surround camera because I'm a shitty parker, but that's it.
There’ll probably come a time where Apple phases out support for really old CarPlay devices, but to my knowledge it hasn’t happened yet, and Apple has strong incentives to keep it that way (since they want to give you incentive to upgrade your iPhone, even if you have an old car).
Phones are very good at offering music, news, and other things that we generally use to fill boredom. I want that option available when I've been in mostly stopped traffic for the last 15+ minutes.
Can it be done without AA/CarPlay? Sure. But it's much more convenient to have the full integration.
Even the electronic safety nannies that are exclusively part of the car get in my way sometimes. I will intentionally disable stabilitrak and traction control on my car every time I start it up, unless the weather is bad. I also feel safer and more in control if I can feel the road through the steering wheel and don't have things like fly-by-wire keeping me isolated from the physical reality unfolding around me.
I've heard lots of complaints regarding things like lane keep assist being too aggressive and making steering non-intuitive or annoying. Good luck disabling that on a 2019 model year vehicle. Everyone wants to be so goddamn comfortable and disengaged while they are driving their 4000lb death machines around. I really don't get it anymore. What are our priorities?
I think the audience for these things are people stuck in bad commutes or long boring trips where they are unengaged from driving.
Having something to listen to actually improves my concentration, prevents my brain zoning out and becoming really inattentive from boredom ;)
Surely if you really wish to enjoy a BMW you buy one with a NA petrol engine ;-)
It seems to me an M-car mostly makes sense if you're going to the track, which I never do. CMIIW
I definitely get the appeal of a diesel! I even enjoy the 8 (?) speed modern 320d/330d. But red-lining a decent petrol engine can't compare.
This is what they WANT. They want you to buy a new one! It's planned obsolescence only without getting dinged on reliability ratings....
Is this right? Apparently the base price for this car is around $60,000, so this person paid $195,000 ($60,000 + 2.25 * $60,000) for this car?
Sure some cars are sexy and go fast, but you can't push them to the limit on the street, you're not on a track.
It makes cars a small fortune compared to the US. When I tell Israeli coworkers that I paid about $6K for a 3 year lease of my chevy volt (after state / utility company rebates), their mouths drop. That's basically free to them.
Also in Israel it used to be common that a benefit you got from your company was a car (because it wasn't taxed as income). It could be similar in other european countries? which hides the cost of the car from many of the consumers. Now, Israel taxes cars basically like income so its not as common a benefit you see anymore (employees would rather have cash than a car). The only reason to get a car as a benefit if for some reason the company can get the car cheaper than you could have gotten it yourself.
Also, it was a demo-car, the price was around $42'000.
It's similar when you buy a car in Oregon (no sales tax) and want to register it in Washington (10% sales tax). If that was a way around paying the tax, every single person in the state would be doing it. The government has thought of this as well. And if you say "oh, I'm even smarter than that, I simply won't register the car in Washington", that gets you a felony conviction when you're caught.
It's almost as if governments can anticipate some obvious loopholes and close them.
https://www.econlib.org/archives/2018/03/why_the_chicken.htm...
So as a private consumer instead of buying a $100k BMW and that ends up costing $225k you'd buy the $100k one, and an entry level $50k base model, and have $75k left to spend on moving parts over before you'd break even.
When that's considered tax fraud and when it's considered perfectly legal will differ by country. I assume it isn't illegal for danes to buy a new engine, seats etc. for their existing cars without needing to change the VIN.
So you don’t know
The chances of getting caught are high. If someone who dislikes you notices a car with Swedish plates staying the night too often, they might report you, and the fines for violation are terrifying, the tax itself with 50% on top if memory serves.
There is an exception for cars under 10.000, I think there the taxes are around 95%.
For that reason, Denmark is full of super small cars and well serviced bigger and older cars.
Yet, I guess the author now moved to Switzerland, at least the number plate does not look danish at all.
On the flipside, some manufacturers impose limitations on what you can do when driving, which is annoying, so after market might get around some of that?
In addition, to my knowledge older Volkswagen AG vehicles are ripe for replacing the infotainment with a newer, carplay enabled system, but on newer models it seems that it is rather locked down and not as easy a solution as you suggest.
But many newer cars have totally custom, integrated audio systems and retrofitting is either extremely expensive or impossible.
Firstly from an aesthetic point of view they're hideous, you'll end up having to buy a plastic piece of crap to hold it in and aftermarket stereos are just not great, it won't be flush to the rest of the dash.
Secondly depending on your car a bunch of stuff that used to work with your car (forward/reverse sensors) might not show up any more.
Thirdly stalk adaptors costs a fortune.
You really want a car that has got that experience sorted and after driving a modern VW, I'd say a VW or Audi is probably the way to go. They'll have Carplay/Auto/Mirror and that's what you want. The experience of an aftermarket stereo is just not great.
My last car, the "stereo" was just a control board with a screen and some buttons. The head-unit was actually under the seat. The space directly behind the stereo controller was air ducts and a center speaker.
* Reading of messages
* Replying to messages
* Correct album covers for things like podcasts, audiobooks
* Playlist support
* Waze or Google Maps (yeah Tesla's maps are good, but they don't have road closure information which makes them pretty useless here in Michigan during the construction season. I often forgo Tesla's navigation and use Google Maps instead)
Sure, Tesla's software is better than pretty much any other automaker, but it's still lacking some critical features, at least in my opinion.
Most people just pull up tesla websites that support the tesla browser.
google "tesla friendly web sites"
Having to use my phone to select podcasts or songs or deal with texts is pretty damn backwards.
The integrated music service for Tesla is third rate and a bit embarrassing. I don't know why I have to be stuck with their terrible deal that they made many moons ago.
Just give me CarPlay or Android, Tesla.
I bought my new radio from crutchfield.com, they did all the compatibility checking for me, suggested all the additional adapters and devices for best compatibility, and for $25 spliced all the wiring harnesses for me. I installed it myself, and have been very happy with the results. I now have wireless carplay, so handsfree works great, I can easily get directions/eta while driving, I can easily listen to podcasts, and as a bonus I get visual information on various car sensors, like which door is ajar, and the PSI of each tire. The most important feature is that it hasn't crashed once.
The result has been better than I expected, there were somethings that weren't quite obvious, such as there not existing OEM adapters for the hands free mic and the gps receiver for my model of toyota. But ultimately, it wasn't hard to run the new mic and the new gps sensor that came with the radio out through the seams of the dash. The handsfree audio quality is way better with the new radio's mic. Everything else integrated with the OEM hardware of the car.
I'm feeling this one. I drive a 2015 Subaru. Overall it's a great car, but the infotainment system is just dire, slow and clunky and painful to use.
Of course the maps in the built-in GPS are pretty out of date by now, too. And you can download new maps from a Subaru web site, but only if you're willing to shell out $200 (!) for the update -- which is just enough money to make me feel like I should put it towards a completely new head unit instead, which would solve a bunch of problems (including the maps) at once. But then aftermarket GPS head units that also support CarPlay/Android Auto cost $700 and up, so...
Sigh.
If you are sick of the electronics, just get a "new" old car. You won't regret it. You can even easily replace the tape deck with a high quality head unit to get all the features you need, but done right because car audio companies are just better at doing infotainment type stuff, and you can get something unobtrusive.
Everything that I thought I would miss, or have a hard time adjusting to be without, ABS, power windows, power locks, traction control, remote start, etc., turns out, I didn't really need it. Yes, there is the safety aspect of it, but I guess that depends on what kind of a drive you are, and what type of area that you live in.
A close family member took a job at a location that was too far away for public transportation and bought a Kia Picanto [0] in 2004. I regularly drove that car until 3 years ago, and it was an overall pleasant experience. The car only had mechanical buttons and switches inside, no screens at all (only a LCD for clock and mileage, and the radio display). The clutch pedal was connected to the clutch via a bowden cable (I know that because it snapped one time while I was driving). The gas pedal was also connected directly to the motor. It had 3 rotating switches for the AC and the heating, a button for the emergency light, and a button for the back window heating. It was an honest car.
I want a car I can control, not a semi-autonomous home entertainment system that tries to mask its mechanical shortcomings with cheap software.
[0] https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/45/Ki...
Everything is pretty much mechanical on mine; in fact, I think the AC controls are still old-school resistor speed control, bowden cable vent control, and vacuum-assist function control. If you look at the electrical diagram in a Haynes for it, you can see that there isn't much "there" - it's still mostly "switch connected to relay, relay connected to accessory" - everything isn't routed thru a computer or such.
My TJ has plenty of downsides that probably don't affect later versions of the vehicle - high gas mileage being the greatest; spartan interior (there's a label inside the vehicle that says "The body of this vehicle isn't designed to protect occupants in the event of an accident, but is only for protection from the elements"!) - though easy to clean (remove drain plugs, hose it out), so much road noise you have to yell to be heard at speed (again - due to the spartan interior), and a rough and somewhat unstable driving experience (part of that is due to my lift and larger than stock tires, tho).
Unfortunately, due to a number of reasons, it's not only an anomaly - but most vehicles sold in first world markets just aren't built that way any longer. Safety concerns (airbags everywhere!) have mandated for larger vehicles, which meant more dash to stick stuff on and in (otherwise, it'd look odd), CAFE rules (here in the USA), etc. Also emissions and fuel economy mean much more computer control, and more "drive by wire" and for some reason manufacturers decided that all has to be routed thru the entertainment console too.
Outside of the first-world developed economies, though, you'll find those cars you want. But you likely as not can't import them, or if you can, they can't be driven or licensed for public roads. Many won't pass US or EU crash test safety standards, if that matters to you. These cars are mainly built and for the markets in India and China - as well as marketed to African nations (I don't know of any "domestic" African nation made commercially available vehicles - there may be some foreign manufacturers though).
One vehicle I wish I could purchase and drive here in the USA - but likely never will (it likely couldn't be licensed for public roads, but even if it could, it probably isn't something you can purchase in single quantities - at least easily) is the OX:
Great off-road handling (for a FWD-only vehicle), diesel engine, build-it-yourself from flatpack, easily fixable, central driver position, extreme hauling capacity - it's like everything I'd want in a vehicle, but sadly I can't own one. Downside is (likely) no AC system - but I could probably hack something in.
I figure that if I ever want a vehicle like that, I'm going to have to build one myself on a small pickup chassis or something.
Snark aside, it's a fair point. If software quality is important, of all current manufacturers, Tesla seems the best fit since their product is as much software as it is car.
Cars buying decisions are becoming more and more about UX and entertainment experience rather than HP and engine specs and even driving experience. It is scary for them to cede control of UI and UX to Apple and Google.
Auto OEMs have can't beat Apple and Google as far as the head-unit is concerned. They should accept this and find better ways of differentiating their overall experience.
This article is absolutely how I've come to feel about cars in the past 12-24 months. If a car doesn't have both CarPlay and Android Auto, I just won't get it[1]. It's like the top feature I care about after number of doors and the engine.
[1] - And there's no way I am paying extra to use it, sorry BMW.
https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughMuskSpam/comments/99sbwa/form...
Take it with a grain of salt, as I think it is sourced from the SomethingAwful forums.
I’d assume the other stuff is true as well.
They offer their own navigation software to automatically plan charging stops on long trips, but for most trips I just want Waze and their excellent traffic aware routing and speed trap notices.
In addition, Tesla's screen is the only interface to the car's critical functions. They're not gonna hand it over to CarPlay unless they were to provide a separate screen for the purpose.
This is like people who think that by using one browser you must "switch" and get rid of the others... no.
But the latest updates of the Tesla stuff are great so I can't remember the last time I used Waze.
CarPlay, I can't speak to, but I find the built-in music features just fine.
I'm really not a fan of the newer cars with tons of complexity and horrible UX (e.g. touchscreens replacing physical controls.) It could be a bit of a "knowing how the sausage is made" effect too, but I also happen to know quite a few software engineers who are into classic cars as well.
He is complaining about the software in his central console that he interacts with each day. It is only a portion of all the software used in the car.
I guess the big lesson learn here is nothing drives a customer satisfaction other what they directly interacts with.
But in general, the car companies take a little more care with those life-critical systems, for liability reasons, if nothing else.
Also newer does not mean better. I have an old 2000 Jeep Cherokee that will probably last an eternity with its stout 4.0L engine. It's currently got 253k miles and is one of the most comfortable and enjoyable cars I have ever driven. I also have a modern 2016 Ford Mustang. I can appreciate both vehicles for what they are, but I wouldn't say one is better than the other purely based on age. In fact, the older one is easier to maintain and parts are far cheaper.
I don't think they're wanting to eschew safety because they like their older car, it's just A) not everyone can afford a new car, and B) the old car controls just the way they want it to, regardless of being less safe.
Personally I've never bought a new car because I could always get something better for the same money that was used.
Maybe I will buy your 2020 car in a few years? :)
The period of most rapid car safety improvements came during a single ten-year period, from 1910 - 1920. Since then, with small variances, deaths per passenger mile have halved roughly every 20 years. The rate 20 years ago was already very low, with the inter-vehicle variance likely greater than the total car fleet improvement.
Deaths per billion vehicle miles travelled (VMT) is the red line in this plot: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4f/US...
20 years ago you had ABS, airbags, side-impact airbags on many vehicles, and crumple zones.
You also had far fewer distractions, whether built-in or carried by drivers or occupants.
Auto MPG is largely a function of engine size. Fleet average in the US remains ~25 MPG. A 1970 Datsun or Toyota would deliver > 30 MPG. Hybrid, deisel, and electric vehicles are exceptions to that rule, but generally, buying a small-engined small car delivers max benefits.
Note too: the improvement from 10 MPG to 20 MPG is twice that from 20 MPG to 30 MPG. If you're interested in fuel consumption rather than range, it's the fuel consumption per distance travelled, usually given as km/100 litres in Europe. 10 MPG == 100 mi/10 gallons, 20 MPG == 200 miles/10 gallons, 30 MPG == 300 mi/10 gallons. A doubling of efficiency would require going 20 MPG -> 40 MPG, or 400 mi/10 gallons.
TL;DR: progress isn't progressing as progressively as progressive would like to think.
I'd be interested to see a study about whether the last twenty years of safety gadgets have actually reduced accident casualties significantly. My thought is that at least as far as collision performance, things have been pretty well understood that whole time.
It has a relatively small incremental benefit. I love the thing, sure, but it really isn't 'worth it' at all, it's purely an emotional thing of having a whizzy whee rocket sled, and I can actually definitely afford it.
If I had, say, the median net worth in the US, I'd be driving a 1998 Civic. That's what I did, until I didn't.
It's just like, not that big a deal. Most people, myself included, are probably doing this stuff for status. Having a battleaxe car is a specific type of signaling in and of itself (in fact this is one of the things I miss the most about my old car...)
I use my Android phone with a mount and Google Maps for navigation, but it's a pretty horrible and distracting experience.
Even though you're actively in driving mode you'll get all sorts of notifications / message popups you'd normally want, but I don't want them while driving.
There needs to be some OS-level quieting of everything except the navigation and phone calls, you can't put the phone in airplane mode because you'd like real-time traffic updates.
The least crappy way I've found of dealing with this is using an old android phone without a SIM card and nothing on it except Google Maps, then teather it to the main phone (with SIM) for network, put the main phone on silent and throw it in the glove compartment. But that also sucks since I'd still like music, podcasts & audio books. So now I need to sync those too to that phone, and it leaves out using the phone (as in, talking to people via voice) through the car speakers.
I agree, but even CarPlay is not flawless. And when something weird happens, it's hard to decide if the flaw is on the phone side or on the car side, since it's not clear how much is the responsibility of the car display.
But there are enough weird glitches when the phone is not plugged in at all.
They’re rare but they happen.
My 2016 car has a bluetooth bug where it freezes the whole radio. I specifically avoided the higher end touchscreen model. The only way to reset the unit is to turn off the car (which can be problematic on the highway). I took it to the dealer and asked if there was a software update for the infotainment system and described my issue. They looked a bit confused at the idea of a software update.
- sometimes nothing happens when I plug in the phone
- navigation instructions are sometimes barely audible even though the music is loud
- Siri sometimes gets stuck
It's nice when it works, but it still feels a lot like a beta.
Siri voice recognition is really bad. The car's built in voice navigation is much better (eg. the car will offer the top 3 choices when it's not sure, and I can just say "2" when number two is correct. Siri on the other hand will almost always try to send me to places hundreds of kilometers away....
- the car can choose to always open carplay when the phone is plugged in, or it could use other signals to "intelligently" decide if it should open carplay. You can try seeing if it pops up depending on what state the UI is in (are you in a menu?), the time since you last interacted with the display, or whether or not the car is moving.
- likely an issue with attenuation on the car's side (if you're listening to music via the car; if music and navigation is through carplay that's an issue)
- car might be doing something to activate or pass through the microphone to the phone
Apple makes damn sure their products inter-operate, but they are not good about following Postel's law - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robustness_principle
It is shocking how much more attention I pay to what I'm doing and even how much more I enjoy driving when I don't have to futz about with a bunch of annoying technology.
I have no plans to ever purchase a car with a built in operating system/screen. The benefits don't outweigh being annoyed by your own car.
Which is why I insist my phone have a 1/8" jack as well as my car: It's the only reliable way of connecting the two. Bluetooth never works and USB always wants to download my contacts when all I want is for my music to play.
Manufacturers take note:
If your shitty infotainment system takes more than 3 seconds to show the video feed after engaging the reverse gear, I won't buy your car.
If your shitty system doesn't let the passenger change radio stations when Android Auto is in use (because the physical button for the radio channel is repurposed to zoom in/out in Maps in Android Auto coughChryslercough), I won't buy your car.
If your shitty HomeLink buttons are non-responsive the first few seconds after the engine is started (because your firmware is bloated and takes seconds to boot what could be done in milliseconds), I won't buy your car.
Anyway, because of this I've been keeping my eyes out for cars that are still in new production today, but are using an old design. These are, in my opinion, better because their systems date from before a time where problems like those mentioned in the OP didn't exist, yet the car is brand new. There's not many out there, any it seems limited to low volume - read: pricey - models. One example is the Nissan 370z.
The one puzzling omission from the BMW software is support for podcasts. For that, CarPlay is the only usable solution.
One major irritant is connecting and disconnecting. This is especially bad when there are multiple iPhones in the car. (I know, what are the odds, amirite?) I had my iPhone plugged in via USB, and playing music. My wife was using her iPhone, which the car decided to connect to CarPlay. And certain actions on her phone somehow confused the iDrive system to stop playing music and bring up her iPhone on the display.
I wish that car manufacturers would either get it right, or turn the whole thing over to Apple. These intermediate solutions just suck.
FWIW, with the G12 this cost like $30 on ebay to fix. (And $10 for the bmw ethernet ODB cable)
I had the odd multi phone behavior so I bought a “usb condom” that blocks data and only allows power. I keep this plugged in for charging and pair only with wifi/Bluetooth.
This stops for me the fighting of multiple phones taking over
Consumer-grade hardware & software is a wonderful demonstration of why aerospace and medical systems cost what they do.
Can you elaborate on what you mean by this?
Automakers and their suppliers could develop to the same standards but the software and associated hardware might well cost more than the rest of the vehicle. There’s no market for that.
When I wanted to charge my phone on the usb-port, I was ask if i wanted to activate android auto. I said yes. The phone said I had to engage the paring break to continue. The parking break was engaged. I never got beyond that.
I suspect none of parties involved (Honda, Google, Nokia) ever tested even the most basic setup.
(Yes, i tried again, multiple times, engaging and disengaing the parking break, the break, turning both devices on and of again, to put the car into neutral), but gave up after about 10 Minutes.
I used google maps with bluetooth audio. But actually, I use want a dash-board mount for my phone. Or maybe, just maybe a monitor in my dash board that connects to my phone. But i highly doubt car makes wont screw that up.
I have a JVC head unit in my car now that does car play/android auto, exterior cameras, etc. I will never buy another car without an upgradable stereo. This usually means I'm shopping on the lower end of the market, but that's worth it to not be stuck with auto manufacturer's software.
Never driven in a rental or borrowed car that had bluetooth that worked worth a damn.
So I bought the cheapest car I could possibly fine, got the the most bottom base model that I could get. Then put in a Sony Stereo headset and separate amplifier that was small enough to fit into the glove compartment. Added a little 12 inch subwoofer to the rear hatch and upgraded the door speakers.
I don't need a loud stereo. I just need one that was decent and wasn't a piece of shit. Spent about 400 dollars and got something that is a lot easier to use and more reliable then what you'd get out of of a 100,000 dollar car.
that car does not have a DCT
This whole thing is dumb as hell. How about a standard like USB-C where you can pass thru keyboards, pointing devices and alt-mode video with one cable? It's a somewhat open standard, and would work with a number of phones RIGHT NOW with no stupid software tricks. Plus it charges your phone at the same time!! Like magic!!
Two counter-examples. While my 2015 Mazda does not officially support Android Auto, clever open-source programmers came up with a way to install it. I did that this spring. When Google updated Android Auto in the Play Store, the update came through without having to make any updates to the car.
And, more interesting to me, the integration is, in my opinion, super sweet. When I'm using Google Maps, arrows are put up on my heads-up display. All the steering wheel audio controls work. The physical NAV and MUSIC buttons take me right to the correct tab in Android Auto, and the back button does what I expect it to.
I have not yet driven a vehicle where Bluetooth or USB to a phone works flawlessly.
I haven't bought one because as seen in another comment here I expect less of the car software than you apparently do, but when I looked into it it seemed to work well for people that tried it.
The Audible app on the iPhone will popup a warning that consists of the BMW logo taking up 80% of the screen with a small text warning at the bottom saying "don't use this while driving" and a small "x" hidden somewhere to close the warning. It's beyond ridiculous.
What gets me most is the Audm app on the iPhone. Whenever I get back in the car after using it, it will cause the car to start playing the same song from my Apple Music library. Always the same song, but randomly picked as far as I can tell (it's not the last one I listened to nor or the first one alphabetically). It's like an alarm clock - you end up hating the song because it comes on every single time you start the car. When I delete the song from my library it will just pick another one. When I stop using Audm, this annoyance stops. No idea what the logic behind this behavior is.
The BMW connect app is currently stuck in a loop where it says it's "doing something", even after having restarted my phone. So it's currently unusable, guess I should reinstall it. This is an 80EUR app which I got so I can remote lock the car cause I always forget and people have helped themselves to stuff in my car so many times. The X1 doesn't lock itself when I walk away, unlike the 116D did.
GPS - garbage interface compared to Waze which I can't stop using despite my aversion to being tracked.
Great car, but many software annoyances.
Cute error messages really frustrate me when they get stuck or display frequently. They just remind me how much I want an error message that gives me something to work with. This seems like the lazy implementation equivalent of “commit” as your commit message.
Imported from India, no GPS working, no maps. The entertainment system is a piece of shit! Bluetooth works fine but Ford India crippled the entire system.
That said, I've realized that touch screen systems have no place in any vehicle. Too damn distracting requiring you to take your eyes off of the road, incredibly risky when driving around Kathmandu.
Cables might sound oldfashioned but they tick these boxes for me. Just buy them in packs and throw broken ones out or repair them. If you get decent ones even that will be rare.
Mechanical rotary switches to switch between multiple modes? Hell yeah. Actual potentiometers that end when you are at max for values that make sense? Sure way.
Since the eighties a lot of specialized interfaces that should have been condensed down to perfection were instead defaced by membrane buttons and a single push encoder that is meant to do all the things. Nothing against encoders, they are cool for certain stuff — but even cooler is a fixed interface where everything is literally in your hands.
That is why touch interfaces are even worse: ever tried to use one with your eyes closed?
The thing is: good working solutions and well defined haptic interfaces pair incredible well with sturdy and wellwritten code. Electromechanical parts are just more expensive, and that is why they fell out of favour.
On the other hand we literally live in times where anybody could build their own car radio if they just wanted..
At the time I had facebook notifications send me sms messages, and if you reply, it would post the reply to facebook.
I had left a bunch of "I'm driving and can't talk right now" comments on random posts without realizing it until days later.
Being able to pair my Android tablet for listening to podcasts is neat. But an FM broadcast dongle had solved that problem for the earlier vehicle, as would an AUX IN port, though it lacks that.
The earlier car had come with a pricey GPS option. My reasoning in rejecting that was that the hardware and software were likely obsolete on installation and would get no fresher. That's proved accurate, and a year later, I had my first experience of a long road trip with the Internet in my pocket. Pre-iPhone era, having maps and Google search was a game-changer, though could be distracting. An assessment I've maintained to the present.
I still rely largely on my own navigation capabilities and mapreading skills. Paper rarely crashes, reboots, or experiences flat batteries.
I read stories such as these with mild bemusement, until the thought registers that I'll likely be unable to find another vehicle as suited to actual transport as the one I own presently.
Pity, that.
Me: “Call Bob Smith.”
Car: “Bob Smith ONLY has a home number, do you want me to call that?!?”
Enters Mobile number for Bob...
Me: “Call Bob Smith.”
Car: “Bob Smith has TWO numbers! Which one should I call?”
Deletes home number for Bob Smith...
Me: “Call Bob Smith.”
Car: “Bob Smith has no OTHER NUMBER, do you want to dial his mobile number?”
It would be funny if it wasn’t so frustrating.
Somebody somewhere made a judgement call: we'd rather annoy people by double-asking them about almost every call, than accidentally dial and ring the wrong person or the wrong number for them.
I think Apple/Siri gets this balance right.
Imagine the goodwill if a 2012 model had a complimentory software update during my next scheduled service. The bastards wont even update GPS maps.
I was delighted to learn there are a bunch of after-market stereo systems you can buy that have CarPlay/Android Auto integrated. I got the "budget" pick from thewirecutter[1] and love it. I had a shop install it, and I got a backup camera installed at the same time that integrates perfectly with the system. Total cost for everything including equipment and installation labor was under $500. Best money I've spent in a while. (I wish I'd got the steering-wheel buttons too that for an extra $50 but I didn't even know it was an option at the time.)
[1]: https://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-car-stereos-with-appl...
What is the reason for these extreme car taxes? as an Australian, I expect if the government here tried to introduce/enforce these sorts of taxes (per [1]) there would be riots and possibly worse - we have a very strong car culture. It would be political suicide to even announce you were considering it.
I see some reference to "green" fees and C02 emissions taxes, but those are in the context of fuel being purchased. Surely this cannot also account for the taxes on the purchase price of the car?
[1] https://www.quora.com/What-taxes-do-car-owners-pay-in-Denmar...
The worst problem was that when I turned the car on, it would start loudly playing random music from my iPhone via Bluetooth. Every single time, without fault. Sometimes it would just happen randomly while driving, too. There's no setting to turn it off. If you google the problem, you'll a bunch of forums like priuschat.com, full of exasperated people who are trying to figure out the problem and failing.
There's no real solution. There is a workaround, and it's hilarious: Create a playlist containing just a single track that contains a few hours of silence. Can't stop it from being played, but at least it will be quiet.
I love CarPlay, and wish every car had it.
I have done some shopping and found an Android Auto-capable headunit that would replace the whole built-in thing, but it's something I haven't jumped on yet. I wonder how many other cars can have their headunit replaced with something CarPlay or Android Auto capable?
Considering that late 2000s cars certainly do all the car things, there is little poing in getting a newer car until the auto industury figures out how to release a 2019 car with at least 2018 hardware and decent software.
First, you have a 2015 car, which means it was built in 2014, Apple Carplay was released in 2014.
Secondly - I disagree about CarPlay being superior, I like the new BMW iDrive much more than carplay. Maps are better in newer bmw, and the voice recognition of addresses is amazing.
Also apple carplay does not support the heads up display, which is a must for me now.
> Not only do they charge you extra to use CarPlay. Even though you own a car with CarPlay-capable hardware
Doesn't Tesla charge you extra for auto-pilot? Even tho your car has capable hardware already?
Also, I hadn’t actually tried CarPlay then, and CarPlay has improved a lot since.
Dunno about Tesla’s charges, I’ve never owned one.
Automatically sending "play" commands - even only when the phone is connected (or reconnected) - is the worst thing ever that I've encountered. Especially with iOS devices. Every single time I turn the ignition on, my car forces phone to play music - and I rarely want that. Makes me want to kill whoever had that design idea (j/k)
I wonder if there are Bluetooth proxy devices (IDK, a pair of ESP8266s?) that just strip certain AVRCP commands sent within 5 seconds after (re)connections while passing through everything else...
I had one album of songs loaded onto my phone. I listened to that god-forsaken thing for hours and hours each and every day, because navigating strange roads in a drive-on-the-left country is hard enough without trying to read the map at the same time.
I would have given quite a bit of money for a simple 3.5mm aux in connector.
Also, CarPlay is feasible (and legal) to use while driving. Fiddling around with the comparatively tiny iPhone screen is both dangerous and annoying.
The software and computer inside a car gets older much faster than the mechanical parts.
Having said that, bluetooth took more than ten years to stabilize and some may not have it right yet.
For Carplay: Apple has constantly been stiffening the conditions for certification, which now includes a multi-day drive test. So the next crop may be somewhat better.
Toyota says there no updates were ever made, despite some issues I'm sure people have complained about. I can't see the harm in open sourcing something like this
Plus side is, eventually I'll just have to learn to either hack it, or cobble something new with the parts.
The maps are terrible in general, but their one small redeeming quality is that they work offline. There have been a handful of times where this has been useful when driving out of reception.
It plays BT and USB audio files, and has dedicated buttons for voice command, call and hangup.
The voice command thing I rarely use because it isn't very good.
All I really want is a way to trigger Google Now from the car controls. My BT headset can do this, but there is apparently no way to do this with the car. Just frickin' open up a hands-free profile connection, and turn on the microphone!
I plan on driving this car for another 15 years or so (or until they stop selling gasoline) but I'll upgrade my phone a few times in that interval. Let me just use the phone.
Besides having only a handful of apps that aren't updated, it takes a long time for bluetooth to detect that my phone is present (30-60 seconds), and every few months it loses its mind and I need to tell it to forget the bluetooth pairing and make it again.
When the car was new (and the map fresh) I tried to use the gas station finder feature -- and it directed me to a stretch of road with nothing at all on it .. not even a former gas station.
I have a 32GB thumb drive with my mp3 files on it; for some reason, 30 or so seconds after starting the car, it resumes playing the contents of that thumb drive even though I might have turned the audio off, or on radio, or on bluetooth. Their menu system for navigating through the 8000 songs I have is super inefficient.
When I drive with google maps on my phone, the audio alerts are forcibly routed through bluetooth ... even if the audio is off in the car.
To be fair, the bluetooth problems could be an android problem.
It also strikes me as funny that the car has GPS built in but there are three dedicated buttons to set the hour/minute/second of the clock.
All in all, a terrible experience. It seems like it is simply a checkbox feature that helps to sell the car but they don't actually care about.
I'm Apple/iOS all the way, but honestly... Entune is relatively stupid and inoffensive and I don't ever think about it. I think I actually wanted nothing related to my tech life in my car. Nothing that resembles my desktop or my AppleTV or my iPad.
I think I don't really want a car. Maybe when I ditch this Highlander I'll live somewhere I can easily do without a car of any kind. Don't even want an EV.
Raspberry Pi for cars. Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l3cPCL1aa0
OP could probably buy an OTT Apple Carplay unit I think, rather than throwing the whole car out just to replace the infotainment.
Of course, this still leaves the obvious flaw of iOS not being able to designate separate 'input' and 'output' devices for some reason.
It's not feasable for any car brand to have a independent, competitive, updated and bug free car software. It will be a matter of time until we have only CarPlay and Android Auto probably with a skin (like we see in Android phones) for branding purposes.
Within a week I bought another replacement for the other car.
Best tech upgrade I’ve made in my life in a while. It really is a huge improvement over any/all software from car manufacturers.
VAT in Denmark is "only" 25%
Yes, you have to pay VAT on the tax, too. It’s bananas.
They did reduce it slightly a few years ago, I think it’s more like 180% in total now.
Carplay still trumps it all of course and OF COURSE it should be standard.
Honestly, nothing really replaces your phone though. A vent mount or a magnetic mount is still my preferred solution.
However, I moved away from Denmark before I bought this car (that was actually part of the reason I got it, a BMW costs less in Switzerland than a humble Skoda would in Denmark).
The market got us here. Why the fuck would you expect it to get us out of this mess?
And how badly they time travel. That's a car developed in 2014. Android audio launched in 2015.
And car manufacturers should at this point get on with the program and offer proper software updates. I didn't pay $70K for the car to deal with this bullshit.
Wow please tell me this is inaccurate? 225% tax??
It is such an expensive car, but comes without the most basic luxuries. What a disappointment.
Luxury car software tends to be pretty terrible.
There are a plenty of actual luxury cars in Denmark.
However these vehicle classifications tend to be fairly well standardized and “luxury” has a specific meaning.
Even in Denmark a 3-series will fall in the D-segment as a ”store mellemklassebil” and isn’t a “luksusbil” in the F-segment.