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Comment by esoterica | Hacker News Reader

Maybe it’s because wages are a lot lower in Europe? Better to outsource to the cloud than hire more people if people are expensive.

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IDK where you get the 'wages are a lot lower in Europe' thing. There are lower cost and higher cost places, but people are expensive and talent is mobile.

I don’t know, in the Bay Area 150k is entry level and big companies pay 250k or much higher to senior engineers. Whenever I hear about pay in Europe it’s a fraction of that. It may be worth it for a different lifestyle, I’m not making that argument. Regardless, from the company POV it must lead to different choices about buy vs. build.

Bay area or NYC sure, that's like being in London, but what about the Midwest, or any of the places where you can easily set up an IT shop without paying a premium for space?

My impression is that programmer and IT salaries are SF>>NYC>>London, even if living costs aren’t similarly different.

how will you attract the talent?

- Get your own bedroom. - 30 minute commute. - Not everyone you meet will be in tech. - You'll be rich compared to everyone else in town. - Partner with local academic institutions to offer recognized research projects and training. 20% time or 3 month project stints etc. Adjunct professor ships for people with an existing research record. - Throw in X free flights to east/west coast, home town etc.

there’s 30 minute commutes in san diego, la and sf if you live in the right areas. what about weather? cali has really nice weather. schools / doctoral candidates / etc are basically useless in the real world. if i’m making enough money the free flights are useless. nothing you said here makes me want to move to the middle of the US. exactly what i’m looking at is the lack of opportunity. say i decide to move for some job and hate it. now what? pick up the family and move again?

The Bay Area is a tiny fraction of the U.S.

Believe it or not most U.S. programmers don't live in the Bay Area.

This is why you see a lot of insurance companies, for instance, with their tech folks quartered in Ohio. Easily half the cost for 90% of the talent.

I'm surprised that more companies aren't playing moneyball with nice, but cheap, locations.

They 100% are. They're not even close.

More likely about trust/security/privacy issues.

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