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Comment by wil421 | Hacker News Reader

I understand what you’re saying but “in much of America” really means California and maybe Seattle. There a lot of comments on HN about a national housing crisis but the South, North East, and Midwest don’t have the same problems.

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Even in relatively dense areas already (NYC), there are tons of restrictions which make it very difficult to build even more densely.

>much of America means California

Low density is prevalent outside of California. Here is a zoning map of Jacksonville FL: https://imgur.com/K6DbVYj

The yellow is all low density residential. Purple is commercial and grey is industrial.

Source: http://maps.coj.net/DuvalProperty/#

It looks like they are trying to improve things.[1]

[1] https://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2018/12/20/new...

Low density != housing crisis. A 3bed with a pool on a golf course can go for like ~$200k[0] there, which is more than affordable on the florida median income of $52k. Compare to San Francisco where a starter home regularly goes for a million+, and it's not like the commute is any easier.

[0]https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/11136-Oak-...

The South has the same problems on a smaller scale. For example housing prices in metro Atlanta are rising way faster than inflation.

I live in Atlanta and fail to see your point. Compared to other cities it’s much better.

When I worked in Midtown I saw 3 high rises go up. 1 for GaTech students, another for apartments, and another for condos. Brookhaven was pretty crazy when I lived there but they have tried to combat the problem with better zoning.[1]. Chamblee added a bunch of new high density housing.

[1] https://www.cbs46.com/news/brookhaven-pushes-for-housing-aff...

I live in metro Atlanta as well. Look at the actual data instead of cherry picking examples. Housing prices and rent increases have outpaced inflation for years.

Also the city added only about half as many new units last year as it did the year before.

And yes Atlanta is cheaper than other much higher density cities, that's why I said we have the same problem just not on the same scale.

There’s a difference between cherry picking and picking the places you’ve lived or worked.

If you own a house you wouldn’t want the value to meet inflation every year. You want it to gain value. Atlanta is a very affordable city by any measure.

Then you can't use those places to generalize Atlanta. The fact is Atlanta isn't adding housing fast enough to keep up with demand. That is the same problem San Fransisco has. It's just not nearly as bad.

>If you own a house you wouldn’t want the value to meet inflation every year. You want it to gain value.

Of course. That's a huge part of the of the problem. Housing can't be both a good investment and affordable. You've basically summed up NIMBYism in 2 sentences.

>Atlanta is a very affordable city by any measure

It is currently more affordable than some cities less affordable than others. But if housing prices keep outpacing inflation and more importantly wage growth, it won't be affordable for long.

Provide some sources about Atlanta not adding housing fast enough I’d love to read it. A recent AJC points out lower interest rates helping out especially in the sub $300k range. This range was the most affordable for first time home buyers. The article points out recent buyer who got a 4 bedroom house in Snellville for $210k.[1] To your point wages haven’t grown as fast as housing costs. Atlanta is also right behind SF in median wage growth.[2]

There’s only one time in the past 30 years where housing prices dropped and people lost money. It wasn’t because of NIMBYism.

[1] https://www.ajc.com/business/real-estate/atlanta-pending-hom...

[2] https://www.ajc.com/business/atlanta-wages-but-not-fast-hous...

Housing prices (both buying and renting) are rising faster than inflation or wage growth and occupancy rates are high. That means demand is outstripping supply. We aren't adding housing fast enough to keep up with demand.

And Atlanta added far fewer units in 2018 than 2017 (you can Google the numbers) so we're actually slowing the rate at which we're adding housing.

>There’s only one time in the past 30 years where housing prices dropped and people lost money. It wasn’t because of NIMBYism.

When did I imply that NIMBYism caused housing prices to drop. I said the exact opposite.

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