Hacker News Reader

Comment by saffronique | Hacker News Reader

Its never been this good for so many people.

That's progressively been true over and over again at most points of history (with various temporary local dips) but that doesn't justify the the status quo, or vindicate our current system as being acceptable.

Serfs probably had a higher standard of living than cavemen, but that doesn't mean that the system of nobility and kings ruling over them was objectively correct, and should be maintained as the one true way to run a society.

I would hesitate jumping to the "justify the status quo" conclusion because of a truthful comment saying things are better than ever.

The fact that billions have been lifted out of poverty in the last few decades is an important note and definitely deserves merit.

Maybe I'm being too harsh, but USUALLY when people say that they are silently implying "so our current system is justified".

Not harshly criticizing something does not mean you are defending it or completely supportive of it. Assuming this "implication" without any concrete statements is at the root of most disagreements.

Thats just china. Lifting billions out of poverty.

China and many other countries combined. Quality of life has gotten objectively better everywhere.

Things could be getting worse and this could still be true through simple population growth.

On the contrary: fewer people suffer, but they suffer much much more. And there's still a ton of them regardless.

We have the most people ever, with the smallest percentage ever in extreme hunger. So I’m guessing you don’t mean suffering from starvation. Who is suffering and why are they suffering much much more?

Workers. As more demands are pressured to be met, efforts to crush unions are getting stronger, and wages are not increasing, workers are suffering more than ever.

Not to say that it doesn’t suck out there for some laborers, but suffering more than ever? Pinkerton agents used to shoot up union rallies, and people (often children) used to not uncommonly get their limbs yanked off by machinery.

The problem is the "more than ever" part. Nobody is denying there are problems (and there always will be), but the collective situation is better than it's ever been before.

This is a microcosm of the whole world, but the statistics about white, middle-aged suicide increasing so much in the west indicates to me a profound suffering, exactly where the article is claiming middle class people are getting some hidden benefit that makes up for the rich getting richer.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/03/23/5210833...

There have been huge gains at nearly all income levels, but not all. The groups missing out has been the 1st-world non-rich. Graph of it here:

https://avc.com/2016/08/elephant-chart/

(note that the green line marks the mean gain, at about 25%, not zero)

So the typical 1st-world person sees people on both sides of them gaining by leaps and bounds, while their own situation is stagnant. That is bound to cause some bitterness. The people below are now providing competition that pushes down the cost of labor, both via outsourcing and immigration.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com