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Comment by fortran77 | Hacker News Reader

I'm not Christian, so I may have some terms wrong here, but:

Isn't Christmas a religious holiday? Can she not attend a mass or a Christmas service and participate in Church events around the holidays? Isn't this one of the main functions the Church provides? Wouldn't there be many opportunities in nearly any Church for social activities?

My local Jewish minyan is having an event tonight with a public menorah lighting, traditional food, games (including an Oculus VR Hanukkah experience!). There were plenty of opportunities to meet people the past few days and during the week. That's one of the functions of a religious community. We sent out public notices on Nextdoor, etc, and invited everybody in the community.

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>Isn't Christmas a religious holiday?

No, not really. There is almost nothing Christian in modern Christmas. Yes, about 15% of nominal Christian will attend church but everything from the date (birthday of the Sun) to Christmas trees are pagan.

In Australia, one of the least religious countries on Earth have Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists getting Christmas photos with Santa at the shops. It is cultural, not religious. It is similar to how Australia loves the Chinese New Year or America loves St Patricks Day.

A typical Aussie Christmas lunch is prawns (not shrimp), crab, cold roast meats and salads.

Yes, Christmas has roots in pagan traditions, but it absolutely is a Christian holiday and the Church has been celebrating it for many centuries. Note the word "Christ" in both words.

And yes, to the GP, these are indeed functions the church is supposed to fulfill. My family used to invite some of the widows in our church over for Christmas regularly, and all our lives were better for it.

Christmas does not belong to Christians, is not a specifically Christian holiday, and essentially never has been.

The date, trees, wreaths, Santa, gift giving, and caroling are all 'pagan' traditions.

Everyone I know, almost none of whom are Christian, celebrates at this time of year in a completely secular way.

I started to write a point-by-point response but realized I just don't want to spend the time on it.

It's possible my grasp of the history here is wrong, but I'm fairly convinced yours is.

I sing Christmas carols with explicitly Christian lyrics that date back at least centuries.

Santa is certainly secular at this point, but he's a young figure, and there's a case to be made that he's rooted in Bishop Nicholas of Smyrna, a.k.a. "St. Nick".

Many other Christmas traditions do have their roots in pagan holidays, yes. Current observance is largely secular, yes.

But, anything that's been observed by Christians for centuries is clearly Christian at least in part. Claiming the holiday has never been Christian is absurd and shows that you've never bothered to study Church history (which of course you don't have to, but if you haven't you should not pretend you know it).

Christ - Jesus of Nazareth, held by Christians to be the fulfillment of prophecies in the Old Testament regarding the eventual coming of a Messiah.

Mass - Mass is the main eucharistic liturgical service in many forms of Western Christianity.

Christmas.

Furthermore, the top comment was mentioning Christian Christmas activities, ignoring the derailment of the discussion into secularity, the answer is most likely a plain yes.

Furthermore, I’m willing to bet that (especially in a large city) there are already Facebook events that are not related to religion that give you something do for Christmas.

Depends on the country and the community, but as a mainstream religion, Christianity's holidays became social customs in a lot of places. Christmas, in particular, is a family event.

As someone who grew up in europe, let me introduce you to the wonderful world of catholic atheism. We celebrate christmas, easter, and have saint nick. We even know all the stories and the lessons.

But we never go to church and don’t believe god exists. Or at least the stories are just stories and lessons, not reality. It’s a cultural thing. Tradition.

In Slovenia where I’m from some 65% of the population self identifies as Christian, but only 32% believe in there being any form of higher power.

I think the accurate term for it is post-Christian society.

Don't know why you're being downvoted, that's a pretty accurate description of christianity in most of Europe.

I grew up in a family that self identified as catholic, I was baptized, and yet we never went to church and frankly religion is not something that was ever a subject of much discussion or interest in the family.

In the US this is called "Cafeteria Catholicism."

Christmas is both a religious and secular holiday. Jesus would have been born at some point of the year other than December according to the Bible, and Christmas (like Easter) was originally a pagan celebration that was likely co-opted intentionally.

Precisely. Christmas is definitely not Biblically inspired just adopted by the church. Elements such as Santa are definitely not Biblical.

I am a Christian who doesnt celebrate Christmas because its origins are extrabiblical and pagan. The 7 feast days (Jewish holidays) are much more Biblical and Christian in my opinion. Even Easter is tainted because it was actually supposed to be the Passover (Pesach) but was based off a Pagan holiday instead.

Despite the obvious there are many Christians who will defend Christmas to their dying breath.

I have nothing against celbrating Christmas I just choose not to go out of my way to get a tree and I dont intend on lying to my kids about a fat man and toys.

I don't intend to lie to my children over ancient myths in general, but they can keep Christmas precisely because it's all in good fun.

This has little to do with the fact that every Church will have some group activities scheduled around the Holiday, giving people a chance to meet and socialize.

If you look for my other comment in the page you will find that I believe there are opportunities to socialize during the holidays for everyone. I was just replying to the question about it being a religious holiday.

In my limited experience, Jewish communities tend to have stronger ties and identity than Christian ones.

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