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Comment by mytailorisrich | Hacker News Reader

Smuggling is impossible unless staff turn a blind eye, or procedures are sufficiently lax. Preventing visitors from passing things to inmates is not rocket science, if you allow visitors at all.

As for drones, let me try to fly a drone over GCHQ or the Pentagon and let's see what happens... But over a prison and then actually drop something? "Oh well, what can we do? Can't even find what they drop..."

The point in all of this is that no-one cares too much so it happens, but it is avoidable.

I was expecting a bit more of a can-do attitude on HN instead of accepting this sorry state of affairs!

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This is not true, I had a troubled youth and did a short stint in my late teens for trespassing.

There are a lot of ways you can get drugs in to prison without the aid of guards.

- Repeat offenders used to getting arrested (particularly drug dealers) would carry their drugs in what is termed a cock sock, which is as you may guess, a sock worn around the male bits to hold things. They would tie pre-weighed bags of drugs up in balloons, and if it smelled they were going to get arrested they would make an attempt to dig them out and swallow them, and then erm, retreive them later in the jail.

- A more creative way was for spouses/relatives to soak certain types of paper in a liquid solution in which had been dissolved drugs like meth, and then allowed to dry. The paper was then written on like a regular letter, and sprayed with perfume (which is a very normal thing in jail/prison) to mask any trace scent of the drug and the fact that it looked like it had been wet and dried.

- Inmates that were in the lower-security units such as day workers, in which they were taken out during the day to perform community service under supervision, would devise elaborate plans to smuggle things in. There were certain work areas that had things like public restrooms, and they would phone a girlfriend/wife the day before to go drop a bag of drugs in the ceiling of the bathroom and then retrieve it while working there the next day. They would place it you know where to avoid having it found when they were strip-searched when taken back to the unit. This was rare though, and more common was that they would pick up cigarette butts as they worked, empty out any remaining tobacco, and then stash it you know where in some sort of balloon/saran wrap to bring back to the unit to smoke. This was done by popping a socket, which is where you use pencil lead stuck inside of an outlet to spark a piece of paper (typically from a book or newspaper) rolled with aforementioned garbage-tobacco.

IF I HAVE ANYONE'S ATTENTION:

The American criminal justice system is one of the most dehumanizing, corrupt, and inhumane places I have ever seen.

I saw inmates have bones broken by guards for saying things they didn't like. They are not allowed to throw punches or kicks during restraints, so what they do is put 3-4 guards on a man and will repeatedly knee/elbow them, particularly in the head, whilst screaming STOP RESISTING, despite there being zero resistance.

It was a common tactic for them to strip a person to their underwear, and put them in a restraint-chair [0] with a hood over their face so that they cant see or move any limb, and then wheel them off to a back room and accidentally forget about them for 4-8 hours.

[0] https://kutt.it/a8OHDg

I don't have anything else to say besides the fact that I want to raise awareness for any of you who may not know what our justice system is like.

We used the brillo pads from the kitchen and a battery. I was very inept at doing it so I just lit it from someone's already lit cigarette. The most we ever did with outlets was making little stingers.

One stupid choice as a reckless 18 year old was enough of an experience for me to decide I was never going back there again.

Unfortunately that trespassing was the lowest-class felony so it has made it one hell of a time for me getting a job later in life, with HR policy in most places and the fact it never leaves your record.

Once was enough.

I was very fortunate when I first got home. I went to a fairly good, borderline great, engineering school. I was lucky enough to be picked up back in my same field. Once I can get my security clearance back or even just naval base access it'll be better.

My father in law has a great story from when he was young: his brother worked out that the easiest way for a then-14-year-old to get tobacco was to head to the local prison. Prisoners then got a tobacco ration, but had no access to sweets. So he would chuck bags of lollies over the wall, and the prisoners would throw bags of tobacco back.

>The American criminal justice system is one of the most dehumanizing, corrupt, and inhumane places I have ever seen.

So this. There's an entire stack of industries that thrive on this inhumanity, too e.g. Corrections Corporation of America, all the medical, legal and culinary/janitorial staff, lawyers and their retainers...

Then again, I've heard jails in other countries are considerably worse, with dirt floors and 20 people in a cell, like Brazil. That doesn't mean we shouldn't improve the criminal justice system here in the US and decrease the abuse of basic human rights in its correctional facilities, though.

Yeah and hacking is impossible unless software developers turn a blind eye or procedures are sufficiently lax.

Good one. People just don't see how life in general is complicated. How much more details are hiding in someones else job. They don't see how their senses are limited.

Prison guard - standing all day with rifle, anyone can do that. Nurse - giving pills and injections, what is so hard about it? Software dev - sitting behind computer all day lazy slob, he could get some real job :)

ha-ha,

If you give people enough time of course they will do that what you couldn't imagine possible in 20 seconds.

Your first comment said:

> The only answer is corruption of the prison staff.

But what you're describing here seems just as likely to be a resourcing and procedure issue.

For example, do you think it's fair that all visitors must undergo a full cavity search before being allowed to see an inmate? Even attorneys? If not, then should the inmate go through that procedure after every visit? Will we all be happy with the increased costs to hire additional staff?

The creativity of prisoners is much higher than you expect. To 100% eliminate smuggling into prisons, you'd need to operate every facility as if its SuperMax.

Smuggling in and out of the visitation room is only possible at lower security facilities. They constantly monitor via video and after the fact on recorded video.

Once they busted the main supplier at Morgantown people got desperate and started trying the visitor's room. One poor guy in a wheelchair got busted with 2 cell phones, 4 packs of cigarettes, and pills coming out of visitation. Absolutely stupid. You could definitely get in suboxone or a couple of cigarettes. Anything bigger than that it wasn't going to work. When you go back in they pat you down, but randomly you can get a significantly more thorough search.

The only place where the guards are an issue are mediums. A $6 pack of cigarettes becomes $20 at a minimum, $50 at a low, and $100+ at a medium. At low and above you'll often find they're selling little matchstick sized cigarettes that are rolled up from the person responsible for cleaning up after guards. It's usually "used" chewing tobacco.

At the medium level you don't get to talk to visitors face to face normally. That makes even visitation smuggling impossible. It can only filter in from guards or from the satellite minimum security camp.

> or procedures are sufficiently lax.

...or effective procedures would toss human rights into the bin. Client-Attorney communication secrecy and visitation rights are one point, body cavity searches and visitation rights for close relatives of inmates another.

You should consider doing more research on a topic before trying to present your opinion/viewpoint as fact. You are stating patently false things, which invalidates your credibility.

Inconvenient things perhaps, but not false things... Unfortunately.

Doubling down on your ignorance isn't helping.

Perhaps you could enlighten me instead of being arrogant?

The state of prisons is avoidable and due to society not caring enough. Is that a false and ignorant claim? Why? I think you should explain because I think that may claim is patently observable and a matter of fact.

Just because something appears obvious to your viewpoint does not make it a fact. That's not how facts work.

> The only answer is corruption of the prison staff.

> Smuggling is impossible unless staff turn a blind eye, or procedures are sufficiently lax

Here's an example: these two statements are false.

Trying to present opinions as facts makes you non-credible, you should avoid doing it.

There's a difference between a can-do attitude and a complete disregard for the exorbitant costs of doing the things you're talking about.

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