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Comment by skissane | Hacker News Reader

> he works at wants to use the MCAS for a non ethical purpose (namely operate and hide the existence of MCAS even when it is unsafe to do so).

You think a programmer, handed a spec and asked to implement it, can be expected to know that their employer (or the employer's customer) wants to use it for a "non ethical purpose"?

Again, I can't know for sure, but I doubt the programmers who wrote MCAS (who most likely didn't even work for Boeing, but rather some subcontractor) actually knew, or could have known, how the code fit into Boeing's larger purposes

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With all of that being said, were these software engineers (probably subcontractors) even given access to actual MCAS readouts or, more likely, virtualizations of expected readouts. These people probably didn't account for this type of faulty readout because the virtual machine never put out that type of fault.

Most types of development in these large companies is so compartmentalized that it's next to impossible to see the whole structure from a software engineers prospective. You need to be at a management level to understand how most of the pieces really come together, which is the only place where one of these "oaths" might make an influence. At that point, however, the selection is so goal oriented, I have a doubt as to whether or not people would take that oath.

Generally, there is somebody (typically in software assurance or systems engineering) who is supposed to ensure the fidelity of the simulator. Additionally, the hazard analysis or failure modes effects analysis should trace to specific test cases.

Of course, there’s all kinds of pressures that make these fall through the cracks. I vaguely remember an article stating some of these documents in the case of MCAS were not up to date

What the actual hazard analysis showed is that Boeing did not have the technical insight at the right level.

The HA listed MCAS as "hazardous" rather than "catastrophic". Meaning those in charge of that process document did not realize MCAS had the ability to down the airplane. I know it's tempting to arm-chair quarterback this, but let's assume they should have realized this hazard.

To your point, maybe the programmer doesn't have the systems knowledge to make those calls, but the process is predicated on somebody having both the technical acumen and the responsibility) for those decisions. This process broke down though.

> You think a programmer, handed a spec and asked to implement it, can be expected to know that their employer (or the employer's customer) wants to use it for a "non ethical purpose"?

No imtringued does not.

imtringued wrote:

> This is basically a reverse audit but the software engineer has no authority conduct such an audit and even if he was allowed to, the business has no obligation to give him the necessary information to determine whether the MCAS will be used unethically.

imtringued is saying that it would be impossible for a software engineer to determine whether what they were asked to do was ethical or not.

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