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Comment by redis_mlc | Hacker News Reader

> often illegal and they are highly secretive about it.

Nope. Primarily insulin is used to help digest 10,000 to 20,000 calories per day, and TRT (testosterone) from doctors.

Most of the Mr. Olympias have interviews on Youtube. They usually don't give the dose so that amateurs don't emulate them, but otherwise are pretty open about it.

(I was one of the strongest and biggest Gold's Gym members in the Bay Area just by sleeping 8 hours a day and going to the gym every 3 days in my 20's and 30's, so you can get results naturally if that's your #1 priority for a few years. For example, I maxed out all of the machines.

Note that if you're an engineer, make sure you have a sensible goal beforehand, since nobody needs a super-heavyweight engineer.)

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I don't usually come on HN to say "you're wrong", but in this case you are.

Steroid use is extremely common in body builders. It's pretty much a requirement since steroids JUST WORK. If you're not doing them, and the competitors are doing them, then you have no shot of winning. Yes, they have "natural bodybuilding", but look at those guys against the pros in the open divisions or the men's physique divisions - there's no comparison.

They are not on TRT. They are taking testosterone doses 4-8x higher than a 20 year old male.

So, steroids, all the serious bodybuilders are using it. The next level to get big is to combine HGH and insulin together. They have a massive synergistic effect. HGH in the morning with insulin around meals and it triggers the cells in the body to pull in vast amounts of energy (insulin) with tons of growth signals from the HGH. Steroids trigger muscle growth and rapid recovery, and the 3 of these drugs together allow body builders to train longer & harder, recover quicker, and convert food to growth much easier.

> "One of the biggest members" - "maxed out all the machines" Call me very skeptical. Yes, you definitely can get results naturally. If you have great genes, you can get very good results. But, you'll never be a body builder level huge without the cocktail I just outlined.

To further my point...

1 - The natural body building champion 2 - The Men's Physique division champion (no testing) 3 - The Men's Open division champion (no testing)

1 - https://gncukblog.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/richard-gozdec... 2 - https://i.ytimg.com/vi/SAhkbadUk-8/hqdefault.jpg 3 - https://i.ytimg.com/vi/O9B7Oden44w/maxresdefault.jpg

That he measured his strength by "maxing out all the machines" pretty much says everything you need to know about the accuracy of that statement

Because the op stated his gym specifically I have credence for this comment.

Good gyms for your build come with the all essential all pervading membrane osmosis crossing competitive atmosphere written by generations (gym generations of cohorts joining and competing really is a interesting subject and I think non builder scientists won't get any results from studying builders till one if them gets into the scene. It's not too hard I nearly did and back pedalled deliberately to later frequent regrets because the community just blows away any other uncontrolled self select non vocational grouping of ambitious men I have even heard about: I have even thought about fictionalizing a extrapolation of my experience how a depressive won't-dignify-brogrammer-hegemony nerd got his balls back thanks to the downright amazing decent people who inhabited my local gym. This was before gyms hardly existed in London and the nearest was called MuscleWorks. Nice pics of Sly and Arnie above the reception counter I thought, learning only years later both worked out there for Mr Universe... Not anybody said anything about those pictures but I soon noticed that same reverent upward gaze and nod like the Catholic genuflect, by the one time it wasn't observed by a visiting engineer... At any rate. I got the best wake up to life in human terms and the subsequent 14 years simply rocked...

Second confidence I take from the op that's being downplayed here is the idea that the op couldn't have built naturally

Well if my pair didn't already clang like bowling balls of solid steel just from meeting some of the regular guys who clearly had enough of my insecurities within ten seconds of observing me and put that Bs straight out the nearest window in the least painful major bsectomy of my life, I have to put the rest down to something about the sheer ts you create after spending time with a bunch of real sound alpha guys carrying less attitude than they let on fat competition days. Immense ts boost. All natural. 5 stone differencs for this otherwise unhappy skinny 6'4" nerd..

If you think they're only using insulin and test I have a bridge to sell you.

All the pros use a variety of drugs illegally, including steroids, HGH, diuretics for show prep, etc. At least Ronnie had the sense to become a cop considering half of the force are already on steroids anyway.

Before anyone jumps to conclusions about what I'm saying, I think it should all be legal.

Plus the cocktails of SARMS and other experimental / unapproved drugs that are circulating currently. And bodybuilder test doses are nothing close to HRT Testosterone from doctors.

In a lot of countries HGH, Testosterone are sold without a doctor prescription. However when this topic comes up on HN it always seems that it's highly illegal to buy and to use it.

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