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Comment by bitlevel | Hacker News Reader

Was interested in a System76 laptop - no longer. US keyboard only, and "use stickers" for non-US? I'm out.

Hilarious. As if “stickers” will change the amount of keys the keyboard has and the shape of Enter and Backspace, etc.

FWIW though, I do recommend trying out US English International. For programming it’s lovely (once you adapt, which is surprisingly fast), and you can also type German, Spanish and others on a single layout.

It’s also the easiest to find from most manufacturers.

I was recently shopping for laptops in Europe and wished I had gone that route. But instead I learned a different layout (which I am very happy with!) that can only reasonably be used on an ISO keyboard since you need to reach that extra key next to enter all the time.

But laptop manufacturers have seriously started putting physical ANSI layouts and putting QWERTZ (the German layout) on it. There were three machines I would have bought if it hadn't been for the keyboard.

I feel ya! I moved to the EU recently, and finding mechanical keyboards is really tough.

There's no lack of vendors -- the issue is the variety of layouts.

After weeks of searching, a found A SINGLE vendor who sold cherry reds with US English layout. (and those two were my only requirements, fortunately).

Glad you found one! Though I am surprised by that, ANSI keyboards are everywhere in Germany. For example you can get one from Cherry itself [0], though it may very well be different in other countries.

[0] https://www.amazon.de/Cherry-G80-3920LWBDE-2-MX-Board-5-0/dp...

I'll admit I had rather specific requirements:

- Mechanical. - Cherry reds. - No number // tenkeyless.

The last item is rather important to me, since it influences my posture a lot and affects ergonomics way more than most people tend to assume.

I'm not American but I've used US styled keyboards forever but I fixed my touch typing a while ago after typing while hunting for keys for 16 years so I use blank keyboards everywhere. Not to disparage the need that you have but you should look into learning to touch type. Practice in the dark without keyboard backlight. It's hard enough to find a laptop that meets our needs these days, I can only imagine how hard it must be to also be looking for i8n.

I believe you're being downvoted for two reasons:

a) While touch typing is indeed a useful skill to have, suggesting that people shouldn't care about a certain feature because you can, in a sense, work around it, is missing the point.

b) Keyboards aren't just different in how they are labeled. I know of the ANSI layout, which is present on this laptop, and the ISO layout, which is used in much of Europe, has a differently shaped Enter key and other differences. There might be other physical layouts I'm not aware of. I can touch type on an ISO keyboard, I can't on an ANSI keyboard. And frankly I'm not willing to adjust to a different layout just for my laptop.

I switch between macOS (US International) and Windows (UK 88 Key), so I like to think I have a few skills. :D

Also, I can touch type already (after far too many years of learning), but that obviates the necessity for allowing others the possibility to use my machine.

Brave, I know...

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