FAA and Boeing manipulated 737 Max tests during recertification | Hacker News Reader

FAA and Boeing manipulated 737 Max tests during recertification

theverge.com

So much for the theory that "the FAA lost so much credibility because of the 737 Max certification that now they're definitely being super careful and doing their job, so we can trust that it's fixed", which I've heard quite a few times around these parts. Nope: the FAA is still useless and you still should not set foot on this plane.

I seriously hate this argument.

It completely defeats itself. Boeing will only have an incentive to be ultra-careful if it expects people to boycott its product out of spite after its fuckups are exposed.

If people say "Eh, no use changing my habits, Boeing will probably improve to preserve its reputation", you're giving them the exact opposite of the incentives they should have.

You're also telling other companies that they can screw over consumers at least once and get away with it if they apologize when they're found out.

This advice describes how pernicious corruption and incompetency are. Instead of insisting on mechanisms to improve competency and trust, you're insisting the spread of distrust is the best course of action.

It will be interesting to see whether this aircraft is recertified under substantially similar conditions by EASA, et al.

To having a corrupt system is a tragedy

Trusting a corrupt system is a comedy

But you don't doubt that the vaccines are safe, right? After all, the FDA told us so!

Are they actually certifying it themselves this time? It is normally enough to pass certification in one country.

Yes. The four main players are Transport Canada, EASA, China and I believe South Africa. Each is refusing to take the FAA certification at its word. Had the FAA been running the program, they would have been up ages ago but the other regulators are being considerably more strict. Source: I work in aviation with airlines who operate the Max

This behavior will not stop if the only price to pay for corporate malfeasance is no admission of guilt, a fine and golden parachute for the CEO. Serious jail time and bonuses clawback is the only way to put some fear into these guys.

Credibility once lost is very hard to rebuild. I won’t fly a 737 Max because I just don’t trust Boeing, or even the FAA, anymore. Luckily for me the pandemic has effectively killed off what little flight loyalty points I once had, giving me an ample opportunity to switch over to airlines that only fly Airbus.

I'll fly on a 737 Max anytime. Heck I'd have flown on a 737 Max the day they stopped flying them. The problems have been fixed quite a long time ago.

You're literally commenting on an article that is asserting that Boeing cheated to get their plane re-certified. That does not imply that it was actually fixed correctly.

If you want to fly alone on a 737 Max, fine. Don't do it above my house. But allowing members of the general public do it is another matter. It's the FAA's job to ensure that the plane is safe, and it sure looks like they're valuing Boeing's profits above that.

The accounts of cheating on tests suggest that Boeing isn’t confident the problems haven’t even been fixed in simulation, let alone on the actual planes.

Faith is a powerful thing.

No problems have been 'fixed the day they stopped flying'

simple question: how do you know?

You have got to be f*ing kidding me! If--When--this fails, it's hard to hide bad test data when they're a flaming wreck just off the runway!

Yeah, it's so silly I almost don't believe it. This isn't something like the car emissions scandel where nobody will notice if you don't actually solve the problem, if another one of these things crashes then this whole thing starts over

Not only that, but any issue with this plane going forward will immediately cause serious public problems, even if any future incident is completely unrelated to the current issue the FAA is trying to cover up for.

News released on a Friday, shortly after stock markets close? Not a coincidence.

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