I also know families that are hard working, responsible, still still cannot afford to make ends meet.
Likewise, I know families who are none of those things, and have never known a real struggle.
Implying that not being able to achieve the American Dream is result of not working hard, and/or living beyond your means is a gross oversimplification and frankly ignorant.
This simulation illustrates that when you have low income how hard it is to make ends meet.
> Implying that not being able to achieve the American Dream is result of not working hard, and/or living beyond your means is a gross oversimplification and frankly ignorant.
Not at all, there are always a few outliers, because, besides the occasional run of just bad luck, a lot of people who appear to be responsible really aren't.
There are a lot of incidental costs associated in life that those of us with savings, and or good incomes can absorb. For those without savings and/or limited income, it becomes a game of robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Yep. And in many of these situations Peter is future you and Paul is current you.
I explicitly deny that we are completely at the mercy of external forces. Our choices have effects that matter.
But yeah, if you're a white straight man and you're able to dodge any crippling medical bills, it doesn't take much more than responsibility to sustain a decent life.
If you're black, female, gay, etc, you may well have lower pay, higher unemployment, increased interaction with law enforcement, etc. That's all true, and is something that we as a society should work on changing.
But within that flawed social environment, black female gay people who decide, say, to use their spare time to try to pick up new skills will probably have better outcomes on average than those in the exact same circumstances who decide to lose themselves in alcohol.
The environment is flawed. Within that flawed environment, individual choices still matter.
The consequence of a broken tail light should impact every American the same. It does not.
Likewise, the consequence of a DUI should also impact every American the same. It does not.
And responsibility costs money. It's much harder to be responsible when you're poor. The immediate threat of poverty alters your decision making process, as does the malnutrition from only being able to afford garbage food. And that's assuming a fair and equitable system, without structural racism or other forms of ingrained discrimination.
Let's quit pretending this is normal or acceptable, or that some free market solution will come along. The solution is wealth redistribution.
2) It's not a coincidence that military targets enlistments from low income areas.
It wasn't until my dad made E4 that he was able to quit his second job working at a gas station.
Sometimes, those soldiers weren't able to escape their upbringing. I'd hear stories of my dad's GIs who would spend their money on alcohol and drugs, and eventually got chaptered out.
I'm not alone.
These kinds of stories are why I, as a north European, have a hard time imagining living in the US. Sure a SE job will pay much more net in the US, but you have litte to no social net that dampens your fall when it comes (as it does for us all).
My partner was diagnosed with cancer little over a year ago. She had all (100%) of her medical bills taken care of by the state. She took 6 months off work on full pay, as she and all living here have a legal right to do. Her employer added 3 months of fully paid medical leave on top of that. She can not be fired due to a medical issue arrising. She has now finished her treatment, full remission and is back at work.
One point I want to emphasize "responsible" in his example really just means not making a single mistake, ever.
I've been poor. You have good as well as bad days. I remember the day I won £75 with £1 on a fruit machine. I also remember the days I'd put £10 in and get nothing. I remember the unexpected bill but they weren't every day, they would be every 6 months so you hadn't accounted for them.
It would be more realistic if it allowed those little moments of triumph, only to snatch it away later.
Also, please list if they had jobs with medical insurance pre ACA, and whether or not they have experienced any healthcare events in their family.
There are a lot of people out there that don't feel the need to spend money to be happy.
If we want to play that game, I can refute the refutal with my own anecdote. I grew up very poor but managed to get to a place several rungs up the socio-economic ladder higher than where I was as a kid. Sure, I worked hard and gritted my way through things like having to skip meals. But a good number of things had to line up just right for me to get where I am today. It was just as much about me seizing opportunities as it was just being lucky enough to have a shot at them in the first place. It is a lot easier to make opportunities for yourself when you aren't worried about where your next meal is coming from or when you can afford leisure activities that build out your network.
When you start off at the bottom, there is no magic Disney formula you follow to reach success. It is entirely possible to do everything right and still end up stuck in destitution.
Here's a hint: the simplistic (I would even go as far as to say ignorant) argument that if you're not making it, you're just not responsible enough. It's just a talking point without having to actually talk about anything.
Bad luck happens to good people. The question is what mindset leads to better outcomes.
In an unjust world is it better to focus on the injustice or is it better to keep trying to make your life better. It seems (selection bias and all) that those that have the better mindset (maybe self-centric to their own communities needs) do better regardless of income.
As long as we're using anecdotal evidence ...
many of the people I personally know who have suffered the worst during the pandemic, are people who never saved or put away money away when times are good. They also, never invested in additional education nor skills. Their disposable income went to vacations, new cars, daily coffee at Starbucks, and a bunch of other frivolities. Always carrying a near zero bank account from end of pay period to end of pay period. But hey, at least they met their responsibilities. They were functioning paycheck-to-paycheck people.
Now many broke and really struggling even if they are still employed. Why? Because of reduced hours or salaries to adjust for the pandemic. Usually these kinds of people are susceptible to the slightest change in their salary. That's part and parcel of not saving and living strictly paycheck to paycheck.
Do they deserve it? No of course not. Nobody deserves bad fortune like this. These people weren't trying to harm others and they were decent hard working people.
However, ... it's not hard to see why they end up like this.
These people were never taught to save away money when times were good, to live within their means, to invest, to do the math before buying a car and making modest decisions, heck, even to have the common sense to know that a daily coffee at Starbucks is a terrible financial decision.
And many of of these people, even people who are still gainfully employed usually retort with: well I'm never gonna be able to own a home, so I buy what I want with my money now to make myself happy., but the thing is, many people who own homes now, also didn't just have all the money available and had to save up for the down payment and probably live a few years house poor.
This expectation that we should all be able to own at least: one smartphone, one computer, one expensive game console, etc. etc. that wasn't a thing back then. Today there are so many things vying for our dollars, that it's hard to just make the choice to save up for a home.
But nevertheless, it still needs to be done and especially now during times of a pandemic, the money we put away isn't for a home, but rather, to get through this crisis.
It is not victim shaming / blaming to point out that stupid frivolous behavior / practices are a root cause of people's problems.
However, it's imperative to understand that bad circumstances, such as COVID-19 can derail the plans of even the most thoughtful, budget conscious and financially savvy people.
The thing is, to never take for granted that good times last indefinitely and not squander money earned.
Imagine two people that both earn $100k a year. Person A spends $50k and saves the rest. Person B, spends everything they possibly can. Person A is working toward a master's degree in their field investing an hour each evening toward it. Person B spends an hour each evening watching netflix.
Then the pandemic hits. (or any other number of other things that are likely to result in job loss.) Both lose their jobs. Person A has savings to get by and ramps up finishing their master's degree. Person B is broke and facing eviction.
Does B deserve to be in a worse situation than A? Well, yes, but by "deserve" I don't mean that I would wish anything ill on them, but A was willing to forgo spending in order to have more security in the future. It is kind of like asking if someone who buys 20k mile tires "deserves" to have them wear out at 20k miles when someone that spent significantly more on 90k mile tires has their's last much longer. It was just a matter of investing in different things with different consequences. Both buying the 20k tires and the 90k tires could be very rational depending on what the person was optimizing for.
I agree with your overall point, but the Starbucks (see also Avocado Toast) argument is a pretty silly trope. By and large, people aren't broke because they buy coffee at Starbucks, or have a smartphone or game console, and they're not going to suddenly be on the path to riches by giving these things up. These things are small. People are broke because of the big expenses: Health care costs, housing costs, education costs.
If someone gives up a $5/workday coffee habit, we're talking around $1200 per year. That's chump change in the grand scheme of things--it's a single trip to the hospital in an ambulance. It would take 40 years of giving up that coffee in order to merely save for a down payment on a $250K starter home.
I find that the people who are the best with money don't take even the little expenses so lightly and try to find good deals wherever possible.
When it comes to coffee, sure, they might buy the occasional drink but it won't be a daily thing guaranteed. They'll usually brew their own coffee.
My point being, that when you're savvy about not wasting money then you're all in most of the time.
Actually, now that I think about it, the new proverbial overpriced coffee or avocado toeast is starting to become online subscriptions.
This is a place where people should really consider if they're worth the $5-10 per month that they pay and hardly ever think about after signing up.
And I know plenty of statistical evidence that says you're wrong. Just looking at wage stagnation and inflation numbers is enough to demonstrate there's a real problem being experienced by people every single day.
But, hey, I'm sure your anecdotes are every bit as compelling...
George Carlin had it right when he said the game was rigged.
It’s clear that money is poorly correlated with a satisfied life. I wish there was a way to track that with minimal bias.
Income is a red herring above certain thresholds.