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Comment by djsumdog | Hacker News Reader

These things are not zero cost. They create pollution and waste and there was literally no scientific evidence at all they did anything at the start of this thing, and there is even more evidence they're a placebo today.

They have grave social costs. There is stigma between people who do and don't wear masks. It has allowed people who commit domestic acts of terrorism (antifa/anti capitalist/anarchists/black bloc) to hide in more public places than would normally be possible.

They're instilling fear in our youth.

If you wore the mask and defended it without question back in March, you'd likely also kill the person in the other room in the Stanley Milgram experiments.

The Masks are nothing more than a conformity experiment.

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You are on Hacker News as such saying anything against the Covid-19 party line will get you down voted. This comment is merely to let you know you aren't alone.

As a supposedly free country we have a large portion of people who are willing to give up all its freedoms out of a little fear. In the history of humanity giving great power to a very few almost never ends well for the masses. Those who are put in place to "protect" invariably seek to become those who control.

If a mask doesn’t work, you’ve put a piece of cloth on your face. In fact, that piece of cloth helps hide your identity on surveillance. That increases your freedom.

There is absolutely no downside to wearing a mask.

If a mask does work, it can help slow the spread of viruses.

Masks are effective at helping an infected wearer reduce spread to others. This is not exotic science, this is not a “party line,” it is accepted and, frankly, obvious scientific observation. Respiratory pandemics are not new and masks have been used to combat them since at least a hundred years ago.

Even the recent study cited by the parent comment of yours admits that masks are still effective at preventing transmission from an infected person to others. Sure, they aren’t effective at protecting the wearer. That was never the intention.

If they are even single digit percentage more effective than not wearing one, why not just wear it? Heck, they keep your face warm in the winter.

it,s not cloth, it,s plastic usually.

The article is about pollution: that's a cost.

Conformity over something that doesn't work: that's a cost.

Fear: that's a cost.

Not being able to relate to other human beings using our facial expressions the same way: that's a cost.

> Masks are effective at helping an infected wearer reduce spread to others. This is not exotic science

There is literally no Science to bake that up. It's literally superstition. BMJ Published research saying they're not effective:

https://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/bmjopen/5/4/e006577.full.pdf

Cambridge says they should only be used as a last resort:

https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/c...

and most recent was the 6,000 person study from Denmark which came to the same conclusion: they do not work.

This is from your source:

"The findings of the study found that adherence to mask use significantly reduced (95% CI, 0.09-0.77;P5.015)the risk for infection associated with influenza-like illness" https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/c...

"A protective mask may reduce the likelihood of infection, but it will not eliminate the risk, particularly when a disease has more than 1 route of transmission. Thus any mask, no matter how efficient at filtration or how good the seal, will have minimal effect if it is not used in conjunction with other preventative measures, such as isolation..."

Cambridge doesn't say masks don't work. You talk as if masks are as effective as dowsing rods and mask-wearers have been duped.

Conservatives like you seem to decide whether they want to conform or rebel based on what day of the week it is. It’s hypocrisy up and down the ideology.

Is privacy and anonymity important? Well yes it is! We don’t want draconian measures like universal background checks for gun sales. That would be an invasion of privacy. But wait, we can’t have people wearing masks, that increases crime by liberals! You can’t just walk down the street and be anonymous!

Is pollution important? Not when it comes to ensuring that the economy keeps going and that American business can operate. We need to get rid of the job-killing environmental regulations! We need more coal to help the miners in Pennsylvania and West Virginia! Did you know that windmills cause cancer? But wait! No no, masks are wasteful, that would harm the environment!

Conformity is okay too! Don’t speak any English? Get out of America! Don’t like saying Merry Christmas? Maybe try a different country. How dare you take Under God out of our pledge of allegiance or stop reciting it entirely! By the way, Trump is right about everything, full stop. BUT WAIT wearing a mask is conformity!!! That’s bad!!

Rebellion? That’s really good! Let’s hang up a confederate flag and be proud of our rebellious nature. Only American patriots are able to rebel against the British Empire. Let’s literally make a Republican Party faction called the Tea Party, in honor of the destruction of property (riots) against our oppressors. We’ve got our second amendment to prevent against government oppression. BUT WAIT!! You can’t let Antifa or BLM or anyone anyone not-white rebel! Thin blue line, support our troops, blue lives matter. How dare anyone question our great police!

The truth is that people like you don’t actually know why you don’t like masks. You can’t explain it because it doesn’t make any sense, it’s literally just selfishness, paranoia, and meaningless contrarianism. Wearing a mask is supposed to be some kind of big deal compared to showing your ID with all of your personal information on it to buy a beer, or getting your nude body scanned at the airport, or letting your employer see your financial and criminal history. But no, it’s the piece of cloth over temporarily over your face that’s invasive.

> Conservatives like you

I'm not a conservative. Why would you assume I am? Is that based purely on my view on one topic?

To be fair, you equate anti-fascism with terrorism; that kind-of points in that direction

I specifically mentioned the Black Bloc/anarchists because they really are domestic terrorists:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy1eRCYS08w

I've met some of them and they are fanatical and dangerous. I made a video about how that type of mentality can destroy neighborhoods and lead to violence, like what happened in Seattle:

https://battlepenguin.video/videos/watch/9f81cd38-3ee9-4f26-...

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