Zadie Smith on the Psychology of the Two Types of Writers (2014) | Hacker News Reader

Zadie Smith on the Psychology of the Two Types of Writers (2014)

brainpickings.org

40 pointssamclemens16 comments

These two types are often called "Plotters" and "Pantsers", with the idea that the Pantser writes by the "seat of their pants".

One thing that doesn't get talked about much is the concept of a third type of writer, the hybrid writer. They will figure out their book's theme, title, three or five act structure, characters, major plot points, and the ending all ahead of time. But this is just a skeleton, an outline. Like a fractal, it gets fleshed out at the time of writing. Writing proceeds linearly from beginning to end, much like the Pantser. When the novel is finished, there are still editing tasks and possible changes to be done.

I've written all five of my novels using a hybrid approach, and I wouldn't want to change. Every author is different.

This is a major problem when trying to make delineated categories, it helps in order to get the concept across but reality is always more nuanced than that. The hybrid type you mention might as well be a third category altogether and should be mentioned.

As someone who writes novels for fun (with almost zero intention of publishing, self or traditional), I've tried so many different techniques when it comes to composing a story.

The only thing for me that is consistently true is needing to know where the story starts and where the story ends. Once I have those two things in mind, everything else comes by actually writing the journey.

I have never been able to successfully outline a complete MS and stick to anything even close. Characters written in real-time do weird things and take wild turns. For me personally it's so important to be flexible with that as to allow my mind space to play.

And maybe I'm weird, but in contrast to Smith's suggestion that once she finishes her draft she's done, I LOVE revising the first (and second, and third) draft of manuscripts. For me, having a messy house to rebuild is so much more fun than micromanaging the story while composing.

Of course I'm also never going to be the same quality of writer as Zadie Smith, so there's that.

I really like your comment, may I ask why you have no intention of publishing your own works?

I'm also in the process of writing a few different works (I have one kids sci-fi novel draft finished, and a couple others in various state of progress).

One thing that may help boost your confidence would be joining a writers group. Eg, once a quarter you submit 25k words to the group, and critique each other's works.

I've learned alot doing this, in terms of variety of feedback from different styles of writer. But equally important was seeing other writers' works-in-progress, which was very eye opening, as the first few drafts are always a pale comparison to the finished product.

BTW, your comment that characters take wild turns in ways you did not expect is one of the great joys in writing! I am more of a pantser than plotter myself, and even if I have a vague idea of what will happen in a scene, it's easy for the characters themselves to take control, and very exciting when that happens!

Good question - for now, I think it's just a way to get stories out of my head. If I ever write something marketable, perhaps my tone will change =)

Writers groups are a good idea though, I will have to look for one near me.

I do a lot of beta reading and enjoy it, so could definitely see myself liking being in a writing group.

Ursula K. LeGuin in her book of essays The Languages of The Night had an anecdote about some editor asking her for to do a big article on how she planned everything out and did all her maps and backgrounds of characters before she started writing Earthsea, and (obviously I paraphrase this as I do not have a copy of the book available at this time) she replied "Dear Editor, this is not how I do it"

Came across this the other day: https://youtu.be/9dqd-_Y1_80

"architects vs. gardners"

Applies to more than just writing.

I'm pretty sure every craft has some form of this same discussion. It's a really weird thing spectators of any craft get hung up.

Where she gets micro managing and macro planner is beyond me. Pantser and plotter are the terms most people have been using for 20 some odd years. Plus, pretty much every writer is a gradient between the two. I've never read or heard anyone beyond the fanfic/wattpad crowd think it's a black and white, one or the other writer type. This whole article sounds more like someone met a published author for the first time and is trying to talk about "secret knowledge". I think Brandon Sanderson does the sharpest, fastest discussion between the two methods, pros and cons, then moves on because in the end "it doesn't matter which you are".

Adding "the psychology of.." is super damn pretentious as well given theres not a lick of data collection, just personal anecdotal meditation on the topic.

Ya it’s just bait. Understanding Complex processes isn’t just a divide and conquer exercise, but divide and conquer is simpler and a portion of what it takes to actually learn something so it sells like hotcakes.

It also gives you an easy out when you’re decent at one side but not the other... it was never in my nature, so there’s no way to improve it, or reason to try.

The same kind of thing that happens with left brain vs right brain, for arts vs sciences

I believe that J.K. Rowling would fall under the macro planner category, I saw a picture once of an outline she had prepared for the entire series on a single sheet of notebook paper, before starting her first book.

Brandon Sanderson takes this approach really far. His status reports on the multiple series he's writing and the release timeline for each is an ongoing source of inspiration for me.

Here's his 2020-in-review post: https://www.brandonsanderson.com/state-of-the-sanderson-2020...

A single sheet of paper for a seven book series doesn't sound too macro, especially given how Smith describes obsessing over details. Compare with Straczinski, who had a whole binder of note cards outlining the 5-year story arc of Babylon 5. Granted, TV show, not novel, but it felt more novel-like.

Rowling sounds more pantsy, like saying "I'm going to drive from SF to NYC, and I'm going to stop at my parents' in Denver", then when the day arrives, you sit in the car, pull up Apple Maps, and say, "hmm, I think I want to go the Las Vegas to Denver route rather than Salt Lake City, because it's winter", and then start driving and find a hotel when you're tired. Snow in Utah? Hmm, should I risk it or stop early? As opposed to planning it all out two weeks before, "Day 1: SF to LV, stay at Bellagio; Day 2: LV to Canyonlands NP, camp overnight; Day 3: Go hiking, weather permitting; Day 4: Canyonlands to Denver; ..."

I think it was here on HN many years ago someone mentioned they "plan the mountains, pants the valleys", which I think beautifully encapsulates the process (at least very similar to how I do it).

I'm primarly a pantser, but I have some basic skeleton framework of a plot. And I usually don't have any idea how A will connect to B and then to C until I'm in the moment writing.

Is there someplace I can see which type a certain author is? Although knowing that an author is a micro planner (or "by the seat of their pants" writer) may ruin some perfectly good books for me.

I don't know that you can figure it out from the finished product. You can learn or infer this from biographies, autobiographies, anecdotes, etc.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com