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Comment by frankbreetz | Hacker News Reader

most of the stuff I've seen is "temporarily remote" until COVID is over, so there is still an expectation that you will eventually come in. Who knows if that will ever happen, but it is quite a different situation between the two.

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I’ve been coaching folks on jumping to new jobs for the last several months (helping others level up is my jam). In all cases, when I’ve told them to have the employer put the remote terms in their offer letter (if it’s not in writing it doesn’t exist), it has been done. Most of the time it’s painless, the few times the candidates have been told no I suggested they walk and the company capitulated in under 12 hours and remote was codified in the offer letter. In no cases is an on site required more than once per month for the folks I’ve been working with, and most are fully remote with zero on site requirement ever (“team building” or otherwise).

Labor market conditions are very clear.

That's quite timely advice. That's a very good point.

It’s not all sunshine and rainbows. You absolutely have to have a BATNA (best alternative to a negotiated agreement, “plan b”, in the event the employer walks away) to operate like this. If you need the job, you have less leverage. Your goal is to maximize your leverage. Best of luck to all seeking new roles, I believe in you!

Almost all employment in the USA is "at will." So an offer letter is not an employment contract. So if conditions change and employer could require you to come in to work even if the offer was remote only and let you go if you refuse.

In such a situation, you would engage a labor law attorney to discuss promissory estoppel and have them prepare and send a settlement offer to not take the employer to court. That is why the offer letter paper trail is important.

In that case the employer should take the employee to court assuming the meritless case does not get thrown out. There is nothing to "settle" with an at will employee.

Is there any sucessful case history of this?

Again an offer letter is not a contract. After you start working your employer can change the terms of your employment, whether it is a month or a year later makes no legal difference for an at will employee-employer situation. Similarly you are free to quit your job after a month or a year without being sued by your former employer in either case. At will employment means the terms of employment are continuously negotiable. However, I believe in some US jurisdictions, if your employer cuts your pay or requires you to work in a new location you may be eligible for unemployment compensation in some cases if you quit. That is about it.

This idea that highly paid programmers could sue their employers if they require them to show up at the office seems ridiculous to me. Unless you are an independent contractor you do not get to decide the terms of your employment. You are always free to quit and get another job though.

Remote is definitely a spectrum. On one end there's "you can be anywhere on the planet" to "you can work from home but we expect you to live in this city or state."

Employers know that remote is appealing to devs, so they're eager to claim they're remote employers. As folks elsewhere have said, read the fine print and get commitments in writing if needed.

So, I'm awaiting an offer for a remote position. However, the documents they produce are generic and include that you may need to travel. It is a huge firm that does consulting also, however, it states I will be working in a internal team on a product.

I'm not sure it really matters. As I can always walk if they require me to come in to the office, but the company has been mostly remote for years and the team is all over the country.

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