If I don’t pay my countries taxes, I risk being put into prison. Doesn’t sound that much different tbh.
Stop romanticizing it.
Yes, some states started from violent protection based tribes (not all of them). This was not taxation. There were/are states and actual laws in the places Bedouin extort people for money under threat of violence. They provided no service in return execpt the promise that they themselves would not harm you.
Absolutely no, extorting "protection" money is not OK and it is not taxation.
I mean he literally didn't say that. He said that he risks being put in prison.
In general, that's in effect the same. You lose your property, and largely fall into cycles of institutionalized crime.
Although, I don't really agree with it since I don't see many modern countries putting people in long term prison for just taxation issues.
Rubbers like the one we're discussing shot you where you stand there is no "system" or "state" or "prison".
Time for a coffee.
Not a marginal difference, but I give up. You need to discuss the matter with people who went through the latter.
I pay taxes. Seems pretty different to me.
At the end of the day they're still taking your resources under threat of violence.
Small difference.
Yeah. Depending on the details of how you go about not paying your taxes I can see it happening. Heck, even if you pay your taxes the tax men might do it to you anyway if you do the kind of business they don't like they think you're unsympathetic enough and can get some political brownie points for screwing you[0](though thankfully this is very rare).
> There were/are states and actual laws
What makes them "actual laws". Surely the Bedouin have customs regarding the right and wrong amounts to charge, methods of payment, penalties for non-payment, etc, etc and those who work outside of those customs would be subject to penalty as a corrupt or rogue agent of the state would be in a "normal" state.
[0] https://i.redd.it/y57gwp4y81q01.jpg
Just because they didn't write it down in legalese doesn't mean it's not a law in practical terms.
From what I can understand the point here is that you cannot choose not to pay
If you live in a democracy, 'the government' is a consensus agreed by the people around you that you live amongst. The government is your family, neighbours, employer, all your fellow citizens. If you really don't like it vote, campaign, go into politics and change it. People do that.
Tax on property is justified as long as a base level is tax free, e.g. the first 500.000 USD in property (including pension funds, home, car, stocks).
Also, i can support other taxes like tax on imported goods for example (to protect internal markets that are of importance to a countries well-being).
The problem with income tax is that low income people risk being put in jail if they can't pay their taxes. And rich people can easily avoid income tax anyway (e.g. earn 1 USD a year from the job and get paid in stock or donate most income to a foundation that is in their own control).
An extra tax on luxury goods (private airplanes, yachts) would also be ok by the way.
The problem with consumption taxes is they can be bypassed in many ways, such as by spending your earnings abroad. I do think income taxes at higher brackets can be counter productive because they also can be bypassed in various ways, but that’s a practical matter not a moral one.
I have links to China and I think the growing implementation and use of income tax in China is a good thing. I hope that it will give Chinese people a sense that they are personally funding government, and that therefore the government should be accountable to them, the people paying its way.
As a citizen I feel a lot more of a direct connection between myself and responsibility for and accountability of government through the income taxes I pay than anything else. I’m proud of my contribution through income tax, but not so much for things like VAT.