CNLabelContactRelationYoungerCousinMothersSiblingsDaughterOrFathersSistersDaught
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CNLabelContactRelationYoungerCousinMothersSiblingsDaughterOrFathersSistersDaughter - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20341855 - July 2019 (176 comments)
Did you change the css to break-word to handle this post on mobile?
I noticed that a large number of posts have words in their titles broken in half at the end, and it’s a tad irksome.
Do you think you could change it back? Long worded post titles break the page sometimes, but break-word messes with a number of titles all the time.
.title a { word-break: break-all; }
.title a { word-break: break-word; }
Thanks for keeping the ship in tip top shape!
FTFY
Also, in case you're wondering why it's not symmetrical (mother's siblings vs father's sisters) is because the complementary set is 堂妹 (younger father's bothers' daughter), and your 堂妹's family name is the same as you.
堂妹's literal translation is "younger sisters living in the same hall" make makes sense when considering how people live together back in the days.
表妹's literal translation is "remote/distant/foreign younger sisters" which you might see them less often in the old days.
Though, people might not know the word Biaomei at all and get confused by the codebase: people know the word "Umami" because Japanese food is popular; people know the word "Mujahideen" because they come from political events and news. I wonder what would lead them to Biaomei...
> The label for the familial relationship expressed by the Mandarin term biao mei, meaning the contact's mother’s sibling’s younger daughter or the contact's father’s sister’s younger daughter. This label variable will also store the name for that concept in Chinese language varieties other than Mandarin. If the identical concept is found in a non-Chinese culture, this label variable will store the name for that concept in the language of that culture.
If they looked up "CNLabelContactRelationBiaoMei" in the documentation and saw the above description, I don't think anyone would be confused.
The Apple way is just long, impossible to parse (whose Father?) and in general pushes a lot of code smell buttons for me ("not sure what it is, but I'm dang sure it's rotten")
My sister married someone whose surname is the same as my mother's maiden name. His mother's maiden name is the same as my surname.
One of our parents' first meetings was to get together and make sure they weren't related...
But in particular: how do you distinguish between second cousins in that case? (The term in question isn't limited to first cousins, after all)
Longest Objective-C Method Name: initWithEnableFan:enableAirConditioner:enableClimateControl:enableAutoMode:airCirculationMode:fanSpeedIndex:fanSpeedPercentage:relativeFanSpeedSetting:temperature:relativeTemperatureSetting:climateZone:
Longest C function name: CMMetadataFormatDescriptionCreateWithMetadataFormatDescriptionAndMetadataSpecifications
Longest Enum Constant Name: kCMBufferQueueTrigger_WhenDurationBecomesGreaterThanOrEqualToAndBufferCountBecomesGreaterThan
But on the other hand, it works, don't change working code.
https://docs.swift.org/swift-book/LanguageGuide/Enumerations...
Looks like someone beat me to this (2019): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20352473, the reply to it perhaps gets to the reason why. Something about Objective C's enums being different.
See here: https://stackoverflow.com/a/13480621
The fact that Mandarin has these terms but English not only does not have but that we find so ... outrageous it gets on HN, is deeply indicative - family matters so much more that it's affecting the language - and that in turn forces kids to learn the words and thus keep their lineage in mind.
As a shallow westerner who hardly talks to anyone outside his nuclear family I may be less "restricted" by my family but I am missing quite a lot.
(No I am not trying to make some sweeping comments about culture, or government administrations or "the modern world". )
I think it's more accurate to say "family _hierarchy_ matters so much more" in Chinese language.
Different cultures emphasize different things.
An example in the opposite direction: Western families would have more verbal exchanges of "I love you mom." and "I love you too." -- compared to traditional Asian families. However, you really can't extrapolate from that language usage to say "family matters more" in America.
I think the thing that makes it "outrageous" is the fact that its name is such a mouthful. If they'd simply called it CNLabelContactRelationBiaoMei (as some other comments have suggested) no one be so "outraged".
Most people seem to be okay with the idea that other cultures can have concepts which are difficult to express in English without using a lot of words. But using all those words, as opposed to just borrowing the foreign term, is an odd choice.
I guess I need to read my thesaurus more often
- relative age (this cousin is younger than you)
- gender (this cousin is female)
- and... an archaic notion of whether this cousin is related to you via a female blood relative (either your mother's sibling, or your father's sister).
Maybe it's just part of the language now, and it will sound weird if you don't make that distinction?
English has similar issues, in that it has two words: girlfriend and boyfriend, which is a bit old fashion, especially when you come from a language that doesn't make that distinction. On the other hand, what would you replace those two words with?
I'm commenting that the terminology dates back to familial structures and housing arrangements that largely no longer exist. Hence, archaic (since it's a historical artifact).
As alluded to by other commenters: in China, women would be "married out" such that they would live with their husbands' families. As a result, the notion of "younger sister from outside" versus "younger sister down the hall" arose.
That distinction doesn't exist if the newlywed couple doesn't move in with either of their parents.
...
On the note of your question: English also has husband/wife, widow/widower, fiancé/fiancée (okay those are technically French loanwords). In the husband/wife scenario, we might use "spouse". And I still find "partner" a bit odd when it's used to refer to heterosexual couples, even if it's perfectly applicable.
Is the more specialized terminology entirely irrelevant in either case (English or Chinese)? No, it conveys more information. But there are certainly situations where it's just not applicable (e.g. if one or both entities identify as nonbinary).
(and as an aside, it's a distinction that makes the language harder to learn with all of its nuances -- my father has no sisters, so I grew up assuming that it was just "which parent's side is the cousin on?")
This is a "doesn't share your last name" relationship in a conventional western family structure.
Consider the weakest relationship between words and thoughts: the words that you habitually use guide/reflect how you think of the world.
If the social relationship of "elder brother's husband" is different for you than "younger wife's sister" in some generalizable way, then words like these are meaningful to you. If you don't have any preconceived notion that you should be more polite or defer to one of those more than to the other, maybe they are just labels.
Cultures and families are different. When they adopt words, they usually have meanings.
E.g. paternal uncle would be lim-sim. Maternal grandmother's son's daughter: life-life-dom-dofe.
Utterly pointless and ridiculous but so much more sensible than having a dozen different words which contain less information than what we care about.
(jk)
CNLabelContactRelationYoungerCousinMothersSiblingsDaughterOrFathersSistersDaughterSingletonStrategyFactory would be the Java equivalent. Has anyone checked Android's codebase?
@dang
it can be fixed by adding `word-break: break-all;`
to the `a` tag for .storylink class.
All: if it breaks anything, would you please let us know?
(j/k you guys would never not let us know)
“A world first: Ocean drone captures video f[break]rom inside a hurricane”
“DMV approves Cruise and Waymo for com[break]mercial service in parts of Bay Area”
“Facebook Thrives on Criticism of “Disinfor[break]mation””
(I’m using iOS Safari.)
:-)
Edit: done now. I can't shake the feeling that we've been through all this before, and that's why I ended up resorting to whitespace tricks in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20352144. But let's wait and see what's broken now...
Demo of a WAM Prolog Implementation in Py
thon
Demo of a WAM Prolog Implementation in
Pythonif youd like to help, im sure theyd love to hear from you at hn@ycombinator.com
https://apps.apple.com/ca/app/hack-for-hacker-news-developer...
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.pranapps.h...
The API for HN is absolute garbage (they admit to it being so too). It's also a read only API and doesn't support actions. My apps rely on scraping the page and then performing actions such as voting, commenting, favouriting, submitting posts etc.
Read-onlyness was a design choice at the time and still has its place. The main problem with the API is that it's too low-level—you have to do a bunch of work to reconstruct what actually shows up on an HN page. The next version of the HN API will give a simple JSON representation of each HN URL. Initially it will still be read-only though; then we'll see about whether to extend it to writes.
> I'm not saying this to defend it - It's not the ideal public API, but it's the one we could release in the time we had. While awkward, it's possible to implement most of HN using it.
https://github.com/HackerNews/API
My words may have been a bit too harsh but I still think I have a point. The only thing I could find use of the API was to get the user's details (karma, description, date created etc). Other than that, I ended up relying on scraping.
Unfortunately, unless the JSON api offers write access, it won't be of much use for my app's use cases. Lets just hope the JSON Api isn't going to break anything major in the HTML of the site and there aren't any major re-designs of the site in the pipeline.
I know that South Korea also has similar distinctions.
Uncle/Aunt/Cousin is fairly imprecise in many cultures.
Also, suppose you’re localizing something to German. You have to learn English to understand the labels, but why would you also have to learn Chinese, etc (how many different languages/cultures gave rise to items in that long “see also” list?)
Finally, if this happens to also be a special case in some other language (I wouldn’t know), why prefer the Chinese (transliterated) name?
Edit: Eh, now I have to go unlearn that lol.
The reason that your father's brother's daughter is not 表, while children of any of your mother's siblings are, is very simple: your father's brother's daughter belongs to the same family you do. Your mother's siblings' children, like your father's sisters' children, belong to other families.
Perhaps in Chinese cultures in the past it was even more complicated, and necessitated terms for specific older and younger sibling's children depending on whether they were the offspring of a brother or a sister.
This seems like such a distant yet specific relationship type. Does iOS really have a field for this kind of relationship in Contacts?
I don't know much about it (never stepped foot outside EU/NA) but apparently some Asian countries have a pretty intricate system of kinship terms. For example Diagram IV in [1] shows different (Mandarin?) Chinese terms for what we would just call a "cousin" in English. I also found the video by NativLang [2] on the topic pretty interesting.
[1] https://ac-journal.org/journal/vol3/Iss3/spec1/huang_jia.htm... [2] https://youtu.be/YOi2c2d3_Lk
https://anilmahato.com/55-family-relationship-names-in-hindi...
(His transliterations seem "phonetic", by the way; e.g. I think you normally write "-ji", not "jee", and so on.)
Or, this looks a little more "legit", but actually harder to understand for an ordinary English speaker who doesn't know linguistics:
https://omniglot.com/language/kinship/hindi.htm
Anyway, between the two, you get the point.
(I'm not especially expert here, but figured I'd mention this because nobody else had yet.)
To me, many of these words sound like almost childish terms of endearment -- a little charming.
Anyway, this is not at all academic for someone who wants to participate in the culture, because everyone around you is going to be identified and addressed in this way, and you're going to have to know who everybody is! Even if, in your head, "chacha" is not some abstract relation, but a particular person.
I'm not sure what the point is, since you also have an option for a custom label, which even if I wanted to add a link for the "younger cousin (mother's sibling's daughter or father's sister's daughter)", I'd probably type in whatever I call that relationship informally as a custom label before selecting that mess.
Also I see nothing wrong with this except for the hungarian PascalCase…
As another commenter mentioned, no, it's not. It's required in Chinese. In English you would just say "This is my cousin", but in Chinese, the word for "cousin" changes depending on the details of how that person is related to you.
https://old.reddit.com/r/iOSProgramming/comments/pya17f/what...
Lone Star: So what does that make us?
Dark Helmet: Absolutely nothing.
It's a cultural norm, and it isn't just a Chinese/Mandarin thing, this exists in many other cultures. In India they also have very different words for different relatives and it has long traditional reasons because historically it was (and even still is today) very important to keep good relationships with a big family network because quite frankly in many places life depends on it.
For example, if you have a sister and she gets married then you'd address your sister's husband's brother differently than if you also have a married brother. You wouldn't use the same word for your brother's wife's brother. Why? Well traditionally (and still today) if a women gets married then she leaves her family home and moves in with her in-laws. At that point she leaves one family and becomes the "daughter" of another family. She'll be living alongside her husband's siblings and his parents. As a brother you will address them differently and with respect because you want them to be good to your sister and because you are thankful that they are taking care of her now.
People should educate themselves more before making stupid comments because it really just shows their complete lack of worldliness, education, ignorance and arrogance. Not attributes which gain you a lot of respect in the world IMHO.
Nobody here has said that other cultures shouldn't have special designators for various family members. Some even knew the specific term for this one and the Chinese symbol for it.
It's perfectly reasonable for programmers to ridicule an unwieldy symbol and offer a shorter replacement. The replacement was to use the same word that is used in that culture instead of trying to describe the concept in English.
I don't see ignorance or arrogance in any of that.