Ask HN: M1 MacBook Pro or Lenovo X1 Carbon with Ubuntu

Just FYI, Lenovo is having a terrible time fulfilling orders. Months of delays with a complete lack of transparency around actual ship times. Not to mention just a comical process around rejected payments and other issues.

I ordered a Thinkpad in July with a ship date of 10-14 days. The ship date has basically slipped to March of next year. I check the ship date every week or so and it bounces around a lot, telling me they have no idea when it will actually ship. I can't even imagine what will happen if they ship me a defective laptop and I have to get it replaced.

I'm 95% at the point where I'm going to cancel the order and switch to either a Framework laptop or a Macbook Pro.

This doesn't help answer your question, but if you need the laptop soon, The X1 Carbon may not be the answer.

OMG, that sounds worse than I expected.. I just asked in their chat window if it is somehow possible to get one earlier than 6 weeks (it said at least 6 weeks) but it isn't :) Their website is also kinda crappy, btw. I am currently running Ubuntu on my old Macbook and it is perfectly fine and fast, but because of a problem with the discrete GPU I don't know how long it will last, sometimes it won't start anymore.. I am looking at the framework laptop again, can't remember why I discarded it... Probably a Macbook is still the least of trouble and best hardware - for the price of being locked in..

I ordered mine on October 8 and it's arriving tomorrow. The estimated date when I made the order, though, was three months out. Maybe I just got lucky.

I have a 4 years old Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Carbon, it's running windows though, but I also develop only on Ubuntu through WSL2. So my opinion is more about the hardware than the software.

I also have a 13" MacBook pro M1.

I use the MacBook, because it has a much better battery life, it doesn't get warm, and it's not extremely slow on battery power. The i7 needs to be connected to power to be not annoyingly slow, but then it will cook my legs and genitals.

The ThinkPad has a touchscreen, which is a huge plus for me, but I am not sure the user experience will be great on a full GNU/Linux distribution.

They are both very good laptops, but the MacBook is much better if you can manage Mac os.

Thank's for the info! The WSL2 solution Windows has is pretty perfect, but that is a red line I cannot see me cross at this point :) That should be built into macOS! I hoped that the Carbon would get better ratings, but so far the tendency is pretty clear pro Macbook..

I have Macbook Air M1 16GB for web dev (including docker and all that plus occasional Adobe Illustrator) and it's absolutely perfect machine for me, nothing hangs or lags with 50+ browser tabs and multiple electron apps open. It's completely quiet (doesn't have fans) and cold, weights nothing, and typing on it is super smooth. I'm super happy I didn't buy MBP this time.

I also picked up the cheapest spec M1 Air for my personal machine, with a view to upgrading when the new Pro's came out. I absolutely have no need to upgrade, I have never even got it to run remotely sluggish. Very impressive for $999.

Thanks for the info! Crazy that the ram is enough, I checked the ram usage on my current machine, and it was about 23gb… It would be much easier decision if they would just let you upgrade the RAM (good old days…), especially considering the crazy prices.

Order the MacBook Pro.

It's still a much better experience and you can still do your development on it just fine and deploy/test with Linux.

I say this as a person who uses the excellent pop!_os as my primary OS at home. It's great, but I miss the general quality and productivity of macOS. (I have an M1 MacBook as well, but am forcing myself to use desktop Linux for an extended period.)

I think I know what you mean, for me it is the little things like the preview app on mac that I miss the most. And the trackpad that is by far better.

Docker - x86 images are a pain with M1 Mac. If you can run ARM images, it’s already as fast as running natively on Ubuntu. The other stuff works great on M1 - photos, videos, etc.

Does that also count for the file system? That was the biggest pain point in the past, working with shared folders between container and host. I even needed a tool called docker-sync to even make it usable..

Yes, the filesystem access was slow both in Intel processor and now M1. I suppose that is to do with the Virtualisation involved. It felt a little faster accessing filesystem on the M1, but that’s just me and insignificant difference.

I’d say if you’re reliant on Docker for work, and that includes filesystem sharing, Macs may not be your best choice.

Thank's for the confirmation, I think Docker is not going anywhere soon, so yeah.. But your impression might be correct (that it is faster..) I read they use a new virtualisation, hyperkit vs hypervisor. This guy even carries a second laptop just for running Docker https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mac-m1-as-dev-machine-d... :))

I have a 2015 MBP and Docker performance was so bad that it was better to install Virtual box and set up a Linux VM, then run Docker inside it. Now I use a M1 Mac Mini and it is somewhat decent (Linux is still better though). But I've only used docker for very small infrastructures, so your experience may vary.

Had the same experience with really bad performance - good to hear that it is better now. I also saw some demos running Ubuntu ARM in a VM called UTM. Not sure if that is more performant than Docker4Mac though, otherwise that would probably be my dream setup…

Check out the Asus ROG Zephyrus Duo 15, even though it's marketed as a gaming machine, it will address all the issues you're talking about and might even compete with the new MacBook pros that just came out this week. It should more than suffice since you use it for mostly dev and would be great value. I've personally reviewed it and YouTuber TechLead uses it. Check it out then do your homework before you buy anything, anywhere. Cheers.

https://www.4alltech.com/2020/06/the-asus-rog-zephyrus-duo-1...

I hate me Asus Zephyrus G15 and want to go back to a Macbook

I've been very happy with my Pixelbook Go. The Linux app is real nice, Docker works great, the Linux is itself a container. I like it better than Linux now because the UI just works as does my second touchscreen monitor.

I am looking forward to a next iteration with some better specs, but they are pretty good as it stands. (not getting in the way of work)

Looks good! I am not so much in Google Camp so, probably could not get happy with Chrome OS...

I'll first check out M1 compatibility for the tools you are using. And then assess the benefits of getting an M1 Macbook Pro (mostly on performance side I think) against a Ubuntu Lenovo (more tools and less expensive).

I myself is using a Macbook Pro 2017 for developing data (some ETL and lots of queries). I don't think it beats the original Carbon X1 I used (but not with Linux, with Windows) but I can't complain since it's a company laptop. I have one serious issue with the Carbon though is that the battery got bloated just after 18 months of usage.

Thank's for the info with the Carbon battery, I had hoped they are more solid... M1 compatibility is ok for the most things I guess, according to https://isapplesiliconready.com Not sure if it is really more performant though for what I will use it for.

I’ve had an X1 Carbon for almost 2 years now as a development machine, and I really like it. My previous laptop was a 13” MBP.

The X1 is light and fast. I run Fedora, and work often in containers. I have the likes of Podman, VS Code, IntelliJ and Atom running and many Firefox tabs open, all without any problems.

Other good points are the 2xUSB ports, HDMI, and good battery life.

The main downside is the 256GB HDD, which fills up far too quickly, so I end up having to do a bit of housekeeping quite often. But as a dev machine, I can recommend it.

My current/last MacBook also had 256gb and yes, can confirm that it fills up rather quickly. Just installing XCode takes 15gb!

Can I suggest, with a similar form factor of the x1 carbon, the infinityBook of TuxedoComputers? https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/Linux-Hardware/Linux-Note...

It has also replaceable ram

Looks good! The only downside I found after a short research seems to be battery life (about 5h)...

It should be that low only if you get the dedicated 3050ti nvidia gpu I think, with the integrated intel xme it should be double that value

Not sure: https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/Infos/Help-Support/Freque... seems the value is the time in idle… the test I read also did not have an external graphics card. But you also might be right!

Dell Precision 7xxx series is the best linux laptop. Dell pioneered official linux support on laptops and they are still the strongest player in this market.

Another thing - Docker only natively runs on linux, on Win and macOS it launches a linux VM which eats resources and will never be as fast, obviously. Kinda ironic too when you consider the whole idea behind Docker.

Thank you for the hint! Did not know that you can configure them with Linux! For the Docker thing - yes, my dream would be just having a Ubuntu partition and macOS for the rest. Maybe it will happen with M1 some time…

I am using Mac Pro mid 2015 which already been to service center thrice.

I am thinking about setting up a desktop with Ubuntu and cheap laptop for meeting and other BS.

Mine had one keyboard fix, single key not working, they needed to change the whole top. Then the first complete meltdown, which luckily fell under warranty, friend of mine had the same meltdown earlier -> no warranty -> trash. Then the second meltdown.. So yeah... I am thinking getting a more specced out Ubuntu laptop with lots of ram, then a base Mac like Air or Mini for the rest..

I've been holding on buying a new laptop for a year now. I realized that I never work outside my home office and I have an iPad (with a keyboard) that I use for reading, light browsing and writing stuff. I'm only interested in a laptop as a backup (if I travel or need to work outside of the house). The M1 Mac Mini is plenty for my work (Web and mobile app development).

If you are in the position to get the new MacBook, get it. Don’t even think about this one.

Even if I need to sell organs for it? (sorry been watching Squidgame :))

Get an iPad (seriously). See https://ghuntley.com/anywhere

The thing that makes a laptop a laptop and suitable for content creation is the keyboard and mouse/trackpad. I have tried just about every possible keyboard and trackpad combination possible with the iPad, and haven’t found a good one yet.

The Apple Magic Keyboard doesn’t let the iPad tilt back far enough to be visible, and when it tilts the screen back the lower edge of the screen blocks the top row of keys.

I’ve found Logitech makes a semi decent keyboard+trackpad combination, but it’s only semi decent and can’t really compare to a laptop for extended use.

Of course, none of this addresses the elephant in the room, which is that there is no Docker development environment that runs on the iPad.