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Comment by moralestapia | Hacker News Reader

>no one who moves to Dubai for a middle class job will ever experience any of the things you’ve listed

Sorry, but that is just not true. You're always one mistake away from losing all your rights and going through a miserable experience. This could happen to anyone who is basically not royalty or extremely high ranks, I've experienced it first-hand.

Everyone knows this, so people are quite afraid to mess up, at any level. Ask any foreigner who has lived there (not just visited) for a while.

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How does it compare to Singapore in that aspect? I get the same impression there when people talk about how it all works really well until it doesn't.

Dubai's much more honest about what it is; an absolutely monarchy that doesn't pretend to be a democracy. As long as you don't piss off the king or the locals, you're pretty much free to mind your own business and do whatever you want, especially if you're indirectly contributing to the king's real estate portfolio/the city's development. Singapore on the other hand is run by hall monitor types who believe they should have a say in every little aspect of how you live your life.

Poor South Asian migrant workers are also treated better in Dubai. In Singapore they have a separate class of work visa with very limited rights, and during covid they were locked down in their worker dormitories for over a year, unable to interact with the rest of society.

Fwiw, a high-school friend of mine had a t-shirt that said "Singapore: It's a Fine City!" and underneath, it listed various legal offenses (like gum-chewing) and their fines.

IIRC you can chew gum in singapore, you just can't buy or sell it (similar to weed laws in certain U.S. states).

Singapore made a concession to allow Wrigley's sugar-free gum and nicotine gum when they entered into a free trade agreement with the US [1], but it's overpriced and rarely in stock at pharmacies.

[1] https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB108629672446328324

I cannot vouch for anything good or bad about Singapore as I have never lived there nor know anybody who has.

But, for sure, there's plenty of places in the world who operate in a similar way.

Singapore operates by the rule of law (except rare edge cases like politics, which are unlikely to concern visitors). You are not going to land in jail unless you commit a crime, some of which you may disagree with, but which are nevertheless made extremely clear to all (heavy fines and potential expulsion for not wearing masks, death penalty for dealing drugs, etc).

Singapore is much more laid back. Usually the worst that will happen with foreigners is they deport them. Apart from drug dealing which carries a death penalty but they only do that when the person is guilty so don't deal drugs there!

I thought they were quite long suffering with "Briton arrested for not wearing a facemask in Singapore' because he said he didn't believe in them and wouldn't do it. I think he was jailed a couple of weeks and kicked out https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9864365/Briton-arre...

They can be a bit harsh with asking foreigners to leave if they have a work permit and lose their job. I think you get 30 days to go which is a bit of an upheaval if you are fired.

> but they only do that when the person is guilty

Hmm..

I think it's more that drug limits and their corresponding punishments are clearly laid out in the law [1].

Singapore's police force and public prosecutor also practise a fair amount of prosecutorial discretion when it comes to charges [2], depending on how people plead their case before it goes to trial.

[1] https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/MDA1973?ProvIds=Sc2-#Sc2-

[2] https://singaporelegaladvice.com/law-articles/prosecutorial-...

US gives you 60 days to leave which is also an upheaval. People on visas are here for 15+ years and can have their entire lives uprooted in 60 days.

Singaporean here. If we're comparing aspects from the article, Singapore has a common law legal system like the US and UK, and debt isn't considered a crime.

It's common knowledge that the Singapore government has ownership stakes in most successful companies operating here via our sovereign wealth fund Temasek Holdings, but I've never heard of private organisations being considered governmental bodies (like DIB in the article).

Our prisons aren't pleasant either [1], but I'm quite certain inmates get healthcare when necessary.

All in, I don't think anyone here would experience a lack of due process, or the same helplessness obtaining legal representation, like what I felt reading the article.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJqRPycWUDg

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