I'm happy to answer any questions anyone has on this. This is an initial set of documentation, and we'll prioritize writing/creating more based on what is most useful to enable Mainboard re-use.
Note that you'll need some fasteners to install everything (see https://guides.frame.work/Guide/Fasteners+Guide/106 for all fastener types)
- 5x Mainboard fasteners - M1.6 1.5mm fastener with a 5.5mm diameter T5 head and 0.6mm thread pitch
- 3x Audio Board and WiFi card fasteners - M2 3.0mm fastener with a 4.5mm diameter T5 head and 0.7mm thread pitch
EDIT: looks like im not the only one to ask - theres an unanswered question on that guide since Apr 2 asking the same thing.
For the 3D printed cases, for simplicity we didn't design in threaded inserts, so you can use self-tapping M2 or M1.6 fasteners with approximately the right length and head size and it'll work.
That's brilliant. Do you see potential for this becoming popular as a "Raspberry Pi on steroids"? Any future plans to encourage that kind of ecosystem?
Do you plan to offer Pro/Enterprise CPUs (Intel vPro, Ryzen Pro), for h/w security features like memory encryption or Windows secured core / VBS?
For open-source firmware and kernel/hypervisor development, it would be good to have a serial port header.
We also have some additional debug support through a header that we've documented here: https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/EmbeddedController
The GPIO would require EC firmware development, but it is technically possible: https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/EmbeddedController
It's actually open space right now in the market. It's an annoyance/limitation that the easiest current way to do i2c/gpio/etc hardware-y stuff involves moving to ARM/Rpi. There aren't any real easy solutions for x86 and hobbyists. I had a friend who worked in touchdesigner (which is x64 only) and it was always a bit annoying he couldn't hook say LED strips directly to his laptop and to touchdesigner (so people spend a small fortune on DMX lights). We ended up doing wifi + esps. But that's much more fragile..
Maybe ideally you'd have a header on the side of laptop kinda like the Rpi400?
But even a separate machine/baseboard would still be awesome in the hobby and education sphere
Besides the FT232H, there are larger FTDI chips with more channels. I am uncertain if one can find USB breakout boards for them, though.
I wish there were some higher-speed, lower-level local busses for communication with subprocessors and other IO (SPI, CAN, etc), but Ethernet is fine.
Not for distributed use, but you can interface with USB and still have real-time signal generation.
Also a quick qn 2 - any plans for a "smaller" board (maybe v2/later)? The current size is fine for a laptop but not ideal if someone is looking for building a tablet/small cyberdeck style device.
Just "shipping" is not good enough if you are a hardware producer who cares whether the product can be legally operated in a country.
However, I think maybe there are ways to achieve delivery even if the manufacturer is not operating in the destination country? Maybe through a third-party partner such as Amazon?
This Chromebook (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07YMM4YC1/) for example, ships from the US and can be delivered straight to my hand even Google don't actually operate here.
Currently, if I want to buy the laptop, I have to hire a courier company to proxy the package (from their US warehouse to the destination country), the company will handle import and customs. But given the nature of the business, the package might be damaged or lost, and when it did, I might only get the courier fee refunded.
Amazon on the other hand, almost never fail, and even if they did fail, I can still get all my money back.
I would totally pay a small premium to get my laptop and other hardware safely delivered. So... I hope Framework consider this.
> With our supply improving, you may be wondering when you can order a laptop if you’re outside of the US and Canada. We selected and are bringing up our worldwide warehousing and fulfillment partner, which is one very key part of the equation, but it takes quite a lot more than that to enable a complete experience in each country. Picking Germany as one example, we need German language keyboards, a Type F power cable, in-box paperwork and labeling in German, localization for the Framework website, support documentation, and checkout flow, support for local payment methods, calculation of Euro prices and taxes, accounting support for German income, creation of legally sound Terms of Sale, Privacy, and Warranty policies for Germany, CE certifications, a local Authorized Representative to back up the certifications, determination of HS codes and tariffs, an Importer of Record to be able to deliver duty paid, German-language in-time-zone customer support, reverse logistics and RMA support for returns and repairs, region-specific sourcing of off the shelf memory and storage, trial builds of German laptops prior to production, and back-end ERP infrastructure to tie all of this together. That sounds like a lot, but it’s actually a drastically simplified summary.
Australia and NZ are easier because there is no new language involved (both use English); unlike UK, there isn’t even a different keyboard layout, both using the US English layout (but I suppose some people in the UK would be happy to buy it even if it had a US keyboard.) The only physical hardware change required would be a different mains power cord. Some of the other issues (regulatory/tax/currency/customs/etc) would still exist, but cutting the language issue out must simplify things.
It is costly, very time consuming (think months to years) and very risky (the authorities often reject things and you need to go back to the drawing board) to do it the official way.
Do you have an estimate of when the Framework Marketplace will be available for UK customers? Currently Marketplace links redirect to the UK homepage, and is only accessible after manually selecting "United States" as a country.
The experience is a little rough with the redirect, and I'd love it if I could put an email somewhere for a reminder when it launches. Otherwise though I'm really looking forward to ordering soon!
[0] Expansion card program at https://community.frame.work/c/developer-program/expansion-c... shows ethernet, cellular, wireless charging.
https://community.frame.work/t/any-chance-of-trackpoint/1026
Lenovo is doing the opposite of what Framework is doing by soldering down memory and making ThinkPads less repairable. Framework has a great opportunity to take in disillusioned ThinkPad customers who are only staying with Lenovo because of the TrackPoint.
Edit: And I want my ThinkLight back! It's not enough to light the keys from underneath -- the ThinkLight was great for giving a little glow around the laptop to light the working area up a bit when in a darkened room. I did a lot of homework under a ThinkLight. And extra points if we can make it shine in red!
Any plan to release an AMD alternative mainboard?
Does it get very hot in your lap for example?
Sometimes it reaches 75%
It's not hot by computer standards per se, but since it's built out of aluminum, there are moments when you wouldn't want to have it on your lap because it would be somewhat painful. Specially with some heavy compilation going on
https://community.frame.work/t/amd-cpus-an-open-letter-to-th...
Now when are the AMD mainboards coming? ;)
Gotta say I was disappointed when the first ones out were Intel.
1) When are you planning to launch in India?
2) Have you thought about launching your own Linux distro optimized for Framework? You could upgrade Linux desktop experience. That would be awesome.
Apple always had the advantage of controlling both the hardware and the software.
Also, in the Linux space, I had amazing experience with Raspberry Pi OS. Not only that it works well out of the box, but being the OS most people use on that specific hardware makes searching for answers to any issues much easier.
Ideally though it would be as close as possible to an existing distro and only include patches needed for good Framework support.
It's a bad idea to force users to use one distro. There are many users who run NixOS, and others prefer Ubuntu, or even Gentoo.
> Apple always had the advantage of controlling both the hardware and the software.
Controlling my own hardware is exactly what I look for when buying a laptop.
And this is exactly why anyone who likes that approach can & will buy an Apple laptop. Framework is clearly going for the opposite of that market. Instead of being a (necessarily) worse clone of Apple, I think it makes sense for them to cater to the market they are clearly aimed at, which is not people who are happy with a walled-garden system.
Once you start getting into specific hardware optimizations you are basically throwing up your hands on the interoperable approach that is a strength of Linux. There is no reason why those changes can't be upstreamed.
Furthermore, I think that, atm, their target market may be 95% of power users who will flash a usb stick with their favorite OS even before receiving the computer.
If you look at the Open Compute project, there's full schematics available for boards that have far more interesting parts than what would be on this.
For comparison, someone has made an entire 386 PC motherboard himself: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29273829
I suspect there's enough information out there publicly to do everything up to perhaps a PIII (Socket 370 era) or thereabouts, but it starts being much harder beyond that.
I have, on my property, a standalone building in which I engage in a variety of activities to include fairly deep level repair of electronics. I have surface mount soldering skills and equipment (hot air rework, magnification, soldering tips), and documented surface mount work on my blog.
But I'm not a "random corner computer shop that can replace RAM."
Do I qualify, should I want schematics?
Is anything patented?
Would you welcome other companies making compatible components?
> licensed under CC BY 4.0
> All of this is a starting point for a broader set of open source Mainboard documentation to enable creation of fully compatible third-party Mainboards in the future.
I don't see any full electronic schematics/BoM in the repo; they don't tell you how to replicate or modify the electronics, just how to fit the form factor.
Legally, it is a bit of an issue as the linked license could technically change.
Technically, it prevents github from recognizing CC-BY-4.0 as the repository license.
Please please please keep the control of your company. The world desperately needs companies like yours.
I can see the "Framework motherboard as SBC" idea catch on for everything from set-top boxes (Steam Machines could make a comeback this way) to a poor man's blade server.
I’ve tried a few times in the last year and finding parts (that are actually available) for a sub- $500 small-form-factor system seems to be beyond my capabilities :)
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Core-i5-1135G7-Processor...
Or could one fully use it "standalone" providing they supply their own usb-c power, memory, storage + external keyboard+monitor?
edit - looks like it can. the 3d printable case is slick, wish it was sold in the store: https://frame.work/blog/mainboard-availability-and-open-sour...
Best of luck with that. I know with UPS even the Ground services include the possibility of going via air if the destination is even slightly disconnected from the US mainland (and I distinctly recall having to program ERP/WMS logic for blocking ORM-D shipments entirely to the Catalina Islands' zip code because UPS would accept the ORM-D-marked package, try to load it on a plane for that last hop, and then send us nastygrams about us being the ones somehow at fault for it); I don't think FedEx is any different in that regard.
It's definitely possible to ship batteries via air, but it has to be marked air cargo only and the fees are probably too steep to be worthwhile unless you're shipping a bunch at a time.
Will a matte screen be supported?
Will a thinkpad style keyboard be available for the framework? Raynaud's syndrome makes trackpad sensing poor.
For those who might wonder why eInk would be cool: Much better reading experience on the screen and insanely long battery life.
W.r.t. power: I don’t think EPD magically runs on less power _while refreshing_. So again, if you are mostly displaying static text and figures —- like in an ebook reader —- it’s great. If you’re constantly repainting the UI, less so.
As much as we may like to think programming is all about staring at walls of text in editor buffers we’ve carefully tuned for readability, IME at least I spend a lot of time switching between an editor, live view of my running app, documentation, log and trace views, etc.
Neither a slow refresh (4-10 fps) with major ghosting or a glacially slow (<1 fps) one that’s clean is actually a very good trade off with most modern workflows. Including ones that are nominally about text, like coding.
Another option is to put the nic inside a tb3 pcie enclosure and connect that. There are 4 thunderbolt ports.
Here's an example of m.2 to PCIe x4 adapter: https://www.delock.com/produkt/64131/merkmale.html
If adapter is possible we could use 4 port gig adapter for a nice pfsense/opnsense router or a VM server.
Also, thank you very much. I love my Framework laptop!
knocking off the mac is kinda cute, but mac laptop ergonomics and durability are terrible.