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Comment by shell-E | Hacker News Reader

I think that one of the biggest things that Celeste has going for it is its movement mechanics. It's this brilliant system where you are given all of the powers you need at the beginning but aren't taught how to use them until completing the game (i think a lot of the mechanics are actually revealed in the B and C sides). This also gives Celeste some killer replay-ability - there's nothing better than going back to early stages and using learned movement tech to break intended solutions. I think I could be convinced to categorize that as a bit of a revolution of game design.

This is also something that Outer Wilds did really well imo.

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It's just a tight platformer with a small twist in the movement mechanic, that's not "a revolution of game design".

Frankly, Outer Wilds plays like shit. The controls are extremely complicated and difficult to wrestle with. However, that really suits the exploratory nature of the game. However, in terms of game design, Outer Wilds is clearly _far_ more interesting and revolutionary than Celeste. Totally physics-based 3D platformer and space exploration game on a time loop is obviously far more mechanically interesting than a 2D platformer with a restricted mid-air dash...

To be clear - Outer Wilds is another design system where everything is unlocked at the beginning, but obfuscated from the player until they play through long enough to learn the mechanics. Same concept, just applied to various game mechanics, but not movement mechanics.

I think there's a lot to be said about the restrictions you put on a system when it comes to design.

I like Outer Wilds! It's fun, I'm currently playing through it. However, Celeste is the more mechanically interesting game when you combine the intentionally limited movement and the forgiving nature of its levels. My 9yo is currently trying to work her way through it, yet gives up on harder Mario levels. Celeste made hard, 2D platforming accessible.

I just don't think 2D platforming with a basic restriction can really be considered revolutionary

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